Jehovah’s Witnesses: Conversation Or Confrontation?

Jul 28, 2014 by

fortuneSince we’ve had so much activity in the comments between active and former Jehovah’s Witnesses, I’d like to point out something that I think most would agree with.

Have you ever noticed that you can’t really have an open and honest discussion with a Jehovah’s Witness about God or the Bible or anything religious?

They can be completely cool and calm when talking about the weather or the ballgame or other trivial things. However when a difference of opinion comes up regarding religion or scripture it is like they go into overdrive. They become animated. They become agitated. They get worked up to the point that their voices quiver and their hands shake. They sometimes even get physically ill. Their volume and blood pressure both go up and their reasoning ability goes down.

This is the typical “fight or flight” response of a JW in the face of anything that would cast any doubt on their beliefs.

I’ve seen it happen. I’ve witnessed it (excuse the pun) countless times over the years as I’m sure you have. I also remember, quite vividly as a Jehovah’s Witness, that horrible feeling in the pit of my own stomach when anyone would challenge what I knew was “the truth”. I would get so worked up that I couldn’t even eat for awhile after the confrontation.

What is going on with that? Why is it that Jehovah’s Witnesses get so worked up when someone who knows “a little something” about the Bible or the checkered history of the Watchtower fails to “roll over” for their theocratic intrusion?

The first thing is pride. Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to be humble but their prideful nature becomes all too apparent when someone directly challenges their flawed beliefs.

The second thing is fear. Jehovah’s Witnesses are so fearful of anyone getting “the better” of them in a Biblical confrontation that they panic. They get all out of sorts and even begin to make things up. Again, I’ve seen it.

And finally anger. They become truly hateful and venomous with their remarks and their outright attacks on someone who dares to challenge them and their most holy Watchtower.

I’m going to ask a question: Who does this resemble more? Jesus Christ or the Pharisees?

Yep. Jehovah’s Witnesses are the modern day equivalent of the Pharisees of Christ’s day. The Pharisees would throw fits and rip their garments in anger. They were hotheaded and they were constantly plotting to trick Christ into saying something He didn’t mean to say. They even made things up about Him just to justify their harsh treatment of Him or anyone who gave him any credibility whatsoever.

Jehovah’s Witnesses are a lot of things but I can tell you after having repeated “run ins” with them on this blog that “Christian” isn’t one of them.

Now for those of you who think my depiction is harsh I want you to realize that under “ordinary” circumstances Jehovah’s Witnesses are the nicest people you’d want to meet. However the second you challenge their authority or pious righteousness or their beloved and most holy Watchtower then look out! The well placed veneer of politeness and decorum peels away and what lies beneath is nothing but a nicely shaken cocktail of malice and derision served up with a healthy dash of sarcasm.

Their sheer hypocrisy is incredible. They have the unmitigated gall to challenge people about their beliefs at the door or on the street often saying: “Well if your beliefs are true then you should be able to examine them in light of the scriptures.” Yet the second someone shows them a scripture that completely contradicts their teachings they clam up and walk away or they get worked up into a frenzy of “scripture bombing” and name calling. They fail to heed the very advice, which under normal circumstances would be good advice, that they so gleefully slop out to the unwitting householder. In reality it is nothing but a salesman’s ploy designed to circumvent the resistance of the householder so that they can get inside their head and start making them question everything that they believe to be true.

The reason that Jehovah’s Witnesses have such violent reactions to Biblical challenges is because they’ve been conditioned to do so, usually over a very long period of time in a very controlling and highly charged mind control program. Oftentimes their need to control others spreads to other aspects of life like dress, cleanliness, and normal everyday habits that aren’t even against official Watchtower policy. They begin to “legislate” behavior for themselves and others all on their own and this is by design. The first thing that a JW asks when contemplating a new hobby or activity is: “What would elder so and so think?”

I thought I’d share this in the hopes that many of the JW’s who frequent this blog might begin to realize just how physically involved they are in their own belief system and how their reaction isn’t logical but rather emotional to the point of pure unadulterated rage.

Again. I’ve seen it.

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335 Comments

  1. Garrett

    You might have shot yourself in the foot Doug. You said it all so perfectly, what can anyone else add?

    “Those who are the most uncertain are the most adamant.” – A. Hitler

  2. I’m about as proud of that post as anything I’ve ever written.

    Thank you Garrett! Love the quote by the way!

  3. Alicia

    Doug,

    I feel like you are personally describing encounters I’ve been through! When a witness feels their belief system is being threatened, they do start making stuff up and resort to labeling ones that challenge them as “apostates”. The desire to control nearly every aspect of other people’s lives is very real, especially with die-hard J-dubs. You and I have ” witnessed” a lot of the same behavior from hard-core Watchtower adherents LOL!

    It’s been over 3 months since I’ve been to a Kingdom Hall, and last weekend one of the local witnesses invited me to a “special talk” on Sunday which I respectfully declined. I finally had to tell her that the reason I stopped going was because of the problem I have with the governing body & the organization’s history. She wants to stop over this week to hear more of my feelings about this. That sounds innocent enough, but I’m very aware that my opinion/feelings will try to be swayed in favor of Watchtower doctrine. I’m open to discussing this more with her, but I’m prepared to stand firm on the facts I’ve discovered. Let me know if you can offer me any advice for when I meet with witnesses.

  4. Alicia,

    I’m glad that my article struck a chord with you. As always, I write from “the gut” and nothing else. It is the truth as I see it and as I’ve gotten older I’m becoming more and more adept at speaking the truth in a way that cuts through all of the normal BS.

    The JW will come with a “friend” more than likely. The reason for that is that if you say anything that would incriminate yourself as being an apostate then they can go back (two witnesses) and tell the elders what you said and they can begin disfellowshipping proceedings from there.

    However, her purpose is probably more noble in that she feels she can guide you back to “the fold”. She will most likely bring you back to a time when you were happy in the organization. She will attempt to access those feelings of innocence and bliss and try to help you to feel that again even if just for a few moments. When you fall under that “ether” you’ll feel like you’re “home” again. Sadly it doesn’t last because once you’ve taken the “red pill” you can’t go back. (Matrix reference.)

    Then she will hit you with the “touchstones” of the faith. She will say things like: “We’re the only ones who don’t go to war.” (An outright lie by the way.) “We are the only ones who don’t celebrate pagan holidays.” (Again, an outright lie!) “We are the only ones who preach door to door.” (Another outright lie.) “We are the only religion that uses the name of Jehovah.” (Yep the lies just keep on coming!)

    Then she will try to get you to talk to the elders about your misgivings in an attempt to “readjust” you.

    I’m curious to know just how accurate my assessment is when it happens so please feel free to post to this thread after you’ve had your visit.

    Thanks for sharing Alicia!

    Doug

  5. Alicia

    Thanks for the solid advice, Doug. I really appreciate you sharing your experience on here as it greatly helps me get through this whole ordeal. I always enjoy your posts because of your candid way with words.

    She actually offered to bring her husband along on this visit and he happens to be an elder. I wonder what they can do to me in terms of discipline because I have never been baptized and I’m not even an unbaptized publisher, thankfully!! Then she also said she could visit me with the witness lady who used to study with me.

    I think you’re right about her intentions of guiding me back to the “flock” and I’m interested to hear her reactions to all the taboo topics such as the mishandling of child abuse, unwritten witness couple bedroom laws, the illogical 1914 teaching, 1975, the United Nations connection and maybe I’ll even throw in the Malawi controversy for good measure! I have actual Watchtower publications printed out from their official CD-ROM & a PDF copy of the elders manual on child abuse to back up my claims, although I doubt that this will convince them that the Watchtower society is faulty.

    I’m going to have to be really prepared to say the least! Do you think the subject matter may be too overwhelming for them? Would you suggest I take one or two topics to discuss at first? Thank you for allowing me the opportunity to share my thoughts on your blog, Doug!

    Alicia

  6. Know that ANY material that you present to them that is from the foul and most despicable “internet” is from Satan himself and that it has been contaminated with apostate ideas and edits. That is what these people are taught to believe.

    Even if you do happen to pin them down with something unflattering about the leadership or history they will take one or two points of defense:

    “That was then and this is now. We don’t teach that anymore.” OR

    “The Governing Body is made up of imperfect men and they make mistakes.”

    With these two points they can defuse just about any argument or attack against them at least in their own minds. You can try to make the point that the Watchtower demands that we believe everything they teach. They might respond with: “Where else will we go?” The standard JW question when something that causes them to doubt is brought up. Of course they misapply this and take it away from Christ, the original point of the question and place if firmly at the feet of the Watchtower leadership.

    Doug

  7. If you’re unbaptized then you’re in the clear. You don’t have to worry about any public repercussions from the group other than being shunned by them if you continue to remain inactive.

    Note: That’s actually a VERY good reason to never get baptized!

  8. Alicia

    You are spot on about the witness mentality when it comes to any information that may shed a negative light on their “precious organization”. I found this out when I spoke to my bible conductor about the false prediction of 1975. She totally incriminated me with looking at apostate propaganda & tried her best to guilt-trip me by warning me about the dangers of looking at information on the internet because it could be edited and twisted with teachings that emanate from the Devil himself.

    Those are two of the most common JW arguments: “Things are different now or the governing body has made mistakes due to their imperfect nature”. I’m prepared to hear something along these lines. Witnesses are a heavily indoctrinated people, that’s for sure.

    Yeah, I definitely dodged a bullet by not getting baptized. I’m very fortunate for that.

    Thanks again for your insight, Doug!

  9. Ed

    why don’t i see my replies related to this topic?

  10. Garrett

    Alecia,
    Secretly record your session with them.
    If they get nasty in the end make it clear to them that you will take the recording to a journalist or 60 minutes who would be very interested in how things actually are behind the scenes. Drop that bomb on them at the end and watch their jaws hit the floor.

  11. godrulz37

    I have found dialogue with Mormons to be congenial, but some impetuous, young missionaries have lost their cool. JWs are generally more argumentative, less gracious, more indoctrinated, more us vs them, etc. They often have a harsh, arrogant spirit that can come from insecurity. They want to be in control and get defensive and irrational. They say they will come back with an answer, but never do. Ex-JWs who find freedom in Christ are great people, but the average JW is more cold than warm. There are exceptions, of course.

  12. I saw that one Ed!

  13. I agree on all points!

  14. Ed

    Doug, I “see” this one too. Where are the others? Ed

  15. Doug,

    Thank you so much for this article. I’ve kind of been lurking on here for a while but never decided to comment. I currently am a JW but I have found out so many horrible things about the organization that I’ve decided I no longer want to be a part of it. It’s very hard for me though because I’m only 17 and I currently live at home with an overzealous Witness mother. Hopefully everything works out for me…

  16. Ed

    Alicia, KIS or Keep It Simple. Is my suggestion. Most JW’s do not really understand or cannot explain the details regarding the deeper things of WTBTS. The “light” came on for me with doctrines like the Cross, failed predictions. Focus on the more obvious. There are many simple yet powerful aides on line you can use to help them. Careful though.. you may scare them away. Ed

  17. Kat

    “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more they will hate those that speak it”

    George Orwell

  18. I have no idea Ed! Unless you posted with a bunch of links in it in which case it was flushed by my spam-o-meter.

  19. Hi Donald,

    You have my sympathy but know that your freedom is coming soon. If you haven’t read my article written especially for teens still at home then you might like it!

    http://thewatchtowerfiles.com/youryouth/

    All my best!

    Doug

  20. So true!

    Doug

  21. Thanks for sharing Ed!

    Doug

  22. Anonymous

    “And finally anger. They become truly hateful and venomous with their remarks and their outright attacks on someone who dares to challenge them and their most holy Watchtower.”…………

    Looks to me they handled things pretty well even under severe persecution…

  23. Wow. Did you know that Rutherford wrote an open letter that was quite flattering to the Nazis during their rise to power?

    What would you think if God’s “prophet” was crazy enough to do that? Would it change how you view your religion or it’s founders?

    What would you do if you found that out to be a true fact? Because it is. I’ll share it with you if you want to see it.

  24. Anonymous

    And also the link above the comment which has this statement in it from the Washington, D.C. Museum

    The courage the vast majority displayed in refusing to do so, in the face of torture, maltreatment in concentration camps, and sometimes execution, won them the respect of many contemporaries.

  25. Here is the entire documented history of this letter on Wikipedia which was mass distributed and sent to high ranking members of the Nazi party by Rutherford and his followers. It resulted in heightened persecution of the JW’s and basically showed that Rutherford was ready to “bargain with the devil”. In this letter he denounced the Anglo American world empire and also stated flatly that they were not affiliated with the Jews. It also had some interesting things to say about the Irish Catholics.

    Even more damning was what was stated afterward:

    Declaration of Facts by J.F. “Judge” Rutherford released at the Berlin convention June 25, 1933:

    “Instead of being against the principles advocated by the government of Germany, we stand squarely for such principles, and point out that Jehovah God through Christ Jesus will bring about the full realization of these principles and will give to the people peace and prosperity and the greatest desire of every honest heart … A careful examination of our books and literature will disclose the fact that the very high ideals held and promulgated by the present national government are set forth in and endorsed and strongly emphasized in our publications, and show that Jehovah God will see to it that these high ideals in due time will be attained by all persons who love righteousness and who obey the Most High. Instead, therefore, of our literature and our work’s being a menace to the principles of the present government we are the strongest supporters of such high ideals.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_Facts

  26. Anonymous

    You erased my other link… Are you trying to hide something? Here is the link again.

  27. Anonymous

    So I see you made it to where I can’t post links anymore. Why is that?

  28. Anonymous

    This is the statement which was talked about at the Washington, D.C. Nazi museum
    http://messiahmyth.wordpress.com/2012/10/30/the-hidden-anti-jewish-declaration-and-attempted-compromise-with-the-nazis/

  29. Anonymous

    The letter is found at the link above posted by the Washington, D.C. Nazi museum

  30. You’re paranoid. You posted the same link in three different areas and I call that spamming. If you have a point make it. Otherwise go bother someone else’s website.

  31. Anonymous

    Everybody knows that Wikipedia isn’t a reliable source. Wikipedia even makes that statement about themselves!

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Academic_use

  32. The letter is real. It was published by the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society and it was distributed and handed out at the Berlin Convention in 1933.

    “Oh but ANYTHING you find on the internet is apostate ridden and a tool of the devil!” – Church Lady

    Rutherford Photo

  33. Ed

    I would love to hav an honest cival open discussion with my JW wife. She can count the time, she would not need to leave the house! I will give her all the time she wants. She must be willing to hear me, listen without going hysterical, calling me crazy, misled by Satan.. Etc. she will never agree to it. Why? I honestly feel sorry for her and for my old friends. When I see JWs out in service, I must say.. I feel some anger, even disgust at what they are doing. Sorry to say.

  34. Anonymous

    If that is a true letter i see nothing wrong with it. It be as if you wrote a letter to the government saying you follow the countries rules for instance like paying taxes and not breaking the law.

  35. Alicia

    Ed,

    I wish for the same thing with my JW husband, but his replies are always the same: “maybe one day you will wake up & see the light”. Strangely enough, I actually hope that he wakes up from the trance of deep indoctrination that so many witnesses are stuck in. All I want is to at least hold an open & honest conversation with my husband about his witness beliefs and why I feel the way I do without him assuming that all the evidence I present is a lie from Satan. It’s a little easier to communicate with him now than it was 3 months ago, but I still feel that he tends to point the finger a lot. Let’s just say I have to be very careful with my choice of words around him. I truly know what you’re going through and can sympathize with you 100%, Ed.

  36. Alicia

    Garrett,

    That doesn’t sound like a bad idea! I can’t wait to hear their response to some of the hot button issues I’m ready to bring up. I have a feeling they may get very confrontational.

  37. Alicia

    Thanks for posting that Declaration letter on here, Doug. I didn’t know about that until I went to that jwfacts website. When you’re studying with the witnesses, that’s something they never show you because they’re kept in the dark about the Watchtower’s true history.

  38. Anonymous

    Jehovahs witnesses know that people were smoking cigarettes back then and celebrating holidays and so forth. They had only just started studying the bible. I see no reason for dogging on people who learned from there mistakes. It be as if you held a grudge against someone well into there 80’s about something they did when they were just a child.

  39. Anonymous

    Anonymous on July 29, 2014 at 7:44 PM
    This is the statement which was talked about at the Washington, D.C. Nazi museum
    http://messiahmyth.wordpress.com/2012/10/30/the-hidden-anti-jewish-declaration-and-attempted-compromise-with-the-nazis/

    Doug why did you replace my URL with this one??

  40. Anonymous

    You keep erasing my URL to the Washington Dc nazi museum website which has a letter there written by Jehovah’s witnesses in 1934 to the government.

  41. Anonymous

    I’d like it to stay please.

  42. Anonymous

    That is the real letter that was sent out.

  43. Anonymous

    And for someone reason you wanted to replace it with a fake found on WordPress.

  44. Karyne Hamid

    Excellent article! Even the comments are extraordinarily informative! Thanks.

  45. I feel your pain Ed!

    Doug

  46. FYI for all my readers: This is another way of saying: “That was then, this is now.” And is a tried and true standby to defend the checkered history of their founders.

  47. I was having a little anonymous fun with you since you posted the link three times on here.

  48. Good! We will let you if you won’t spam the links. 😉

  49. Thanks Karyne!

  50. William

    When information is found from unreliable sources it’s quite easy to pick things out isn’t it? I haven’t found anything of the jw history that makes them horrible people at all. We’re all imperfect are we not? And we make mistakes. Why then do we act like we haven’t done anything in the past, that we today regret. The real link that annon posted here Gives a lot of good info. I’m quite amazed actually. The fact that annon commented that they had only just started learning about the bible makes it even better. With what they had learned they were quite set on to the point of being persecuted, and many even put to death. Now that is faith!

  51. Ed

    As you may know, the WT guys tell them not to speak to any one anti JW. We may open their eyes to the real truth! I suppose the best way to win them over is by example. Sometimes not easy to do. Ed

  52. William

    I see nothing wrong with JWs only being friends with other jws. Are you not doing the same by only being for anti jws? Isn’t that the point of this website even, to form a group for those who are anti jws and to discuss among people why you should be anti-jw as well.

  53. William

    I see nothing wrong with them choosing to be friends and communicating with people that share their same beliefs. Let’s say two people met. One was a democrat and the other republican. Would they really be able to talk about matters openly and agree with each other on the same aspects. Would they be best friends? People choose friends who are most like them. If they didn’t friendship between the two wouldn’t exist.

  54. Donald

    Thank you Doug. That article is extremely helpful. I just wish my family was a little more open minded. I feel so bad for my grandparents who have dedicated their entire lives to this organization. On top of all that they’ve wanted me to go to Bethel since I was a child, and I have to constantly express that I don’t want to. It’s a mess.

  55. William

    Personally I wouldn’t listen to Doug on matters concerning the jws. The fact that he’s an activist against the jws is even more of a reason to not listen to him. Wasn’t hitler an activist, even against jws.

    The fact that he even made this statement:
    Doug Shields on July 29, 2014 at 7:33 PM
    Wow. Did you know that Rutherford wrote an open letter that was quite flattering to the Nazis during their rise to power?

    Flattering…? I’m pretty sure if it was flattering to the nazis they wouldn’t have sent them to camps and abused or even killed them. He’s trying to say that Jws were for the nazis when historians and teachers who actually have studied all aspects of the holocaust and who “mind you “are not even jehovahs witnesses beg to differ.

    The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum has the original letter was written which states this.

    This letter dated October 7, 1934, was sent to the German government by every congregation of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Germany. This declaration of political neutrality failed to convince the Nazi regime that the Witnesses were harmless.

    To the Officials of the Government:

    The Word of Jehovah God, as set out in the Holy Bible, is the supreme law and to us it is our sole guide for the reason that we have devoted ourselves to God and are true and sincere followers of Christ Jesus.

    During the past year, and contrary to God’s law and in violation of our rights, you have forbidden us as Jehovah’s Witnesses to meet together to study God’s Word and worship and serve Him. In His Word he commands us that we shall not forsake the assembling of ourselves together. (Hebrews 10:25) To us Jehovah commands: ‘Ye are my witnesses that I am God. Go and tell the people my message.’ (Isaiah 43:10, 12; Isaiah 6:9; Matthew 24:14) There is a direct conflict between your law and God’s law, and, following the lead of the faithful apostles we ought to obey God rather than men,’ and this we will do. (Acts 5:29) Therefore this is to advise you that at any cost we will obey God’s commandments, will meet together for the study of His Word, and will worship and serve Him as He has commanded. If your government or officers do violence to us because we are obeying God, then our blood will be upon you and you will answer to Almighty God.

    We have no interest in political affairs, but are wholly devoted to God’s Kingdom under Christ His King. We will do no injury or harm to anyone. We would delight to dwell in peace and do good to all men as we have opportunity, but, since your government and its officers continue in your attempt to force us to disobey the highest law of the universe, we are compelled to now give you notice that we will, by His Grace, obey Jehovah God and fully trust Him to deliver us from all oppression and oppressors.

    When Doug says they are violent and angry people that is an outright lie. If they were like that wouldn’t they have not received so much abuse as they did
    Seems to me and many other people that they are actually the victims of violent and angry behavior. Even by activist today.. Even On this very site.

    The historians state this which can be found at the The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum website.

    The children of Jehovah’s Witnesses also suffered. In classrooms, teachers ridiculed children who refused to give the “Heil, Hitler!” salute or sing patriotic songs. Classmates shunned and beat up young Witnesses. Principals expelled them from schools. Families were broken up as authorities took children away from their parents and sent them to reform schools, orphanages, or private homes, to be brought up as Nazis.

    Unlike Jews and Sinti and Roma (“Gypsies”), persecuted and killed by virtue of their birth, Jehovah’s Witnesses had the opportunity to escape persecution and personal harm by renouncing their religious beliefs. The courage the vast majority displayed in refusing to do so, in the face of torture, maltreatment in concentration camps, and sometimes execution, won them the respect of many contemporaries.

  56. godrulz37

    This is not proof of truth for JWs. Many homosexuals, Jews, CHRISTIANS, etc died, including for not renouncing their faith. Many more Jews and Christians died than JWs. Any loss of life to evil is tragic, though. WT points fingers at Catholics and ‘Christendom’, but have many skeletons in their closet that they try to sanitize. Given their exaggerated claims about who they are as an organization, this is problematic and hypocritical.

  57. Anonymous

    Everyone has opinions don’t they? All I did was give facts of what the holocaust historians has done research on regarding Jehovah’s Witnesses during that time. I was not stating that they were the only ones who endured abuse during that time. I’m simply stating that they were and still are being victims of abuse to this day. Even by Catholics and other religions.

  58. Anonymous

    They don’t hide anything. That is ridiculous the fact that they openly invite people to there place of worship the fact that they openly preach what they believe. If you were trying to hide something..wouldn’t you not dare do any of those things? In fact every church I’ve seen try’s to manipulate people into thinking they are no good and that they are liars.Are they not displaying the same attitude of satan in that regard satan,the father of the lie who manipulated Adam and Eve into thinking god was a liar? Seems like the churches are trying to hide something when the only thing they preach is to stay away from the Jws and not to read there literature.

  59. Anonymous

    That is why so many of the members of most churches do not know there bible. The preacher simply opens the bible up in front of everyone yet reads nothing from it. I have seen this many many many times.

  60. Anonymous

    So how can they claim to be followers of the bible when they do not read what’s right in front of them. If you want to bully someone then go to the vadicin and ask the pope why he has an entire temple full of golds and riches that he keeps to himself. Ask him why he wears such expensive garments when the bible says not to and why he thinks people should bow down to him instead of god. I’m pretty sure all of the wealth that they have was forced out of there own people every single day. And I find that very disturbing.

  61. godrulz37

    Vatican. We do not agree with extra/contrabiblical Catholic issues either. JWs are anti-Catholic because of Russell and Rutherford. Many JWs are ex-Catholics because neither group really knows the Bible as well as they should. WT has most certainly hid their history. I have photo reprints of WT editions that changed dates in later editions without admitting their false prophecies in an Orwellian cover up. It is only because of internet and counter-cult ministries that WT is being forced to be more transparent. Their campaign to mind control members with fear, destroying old literature from the libraries, forbidding reading so-called apostate literature (Raymond Franz, Crisis of Conscience), etc. is not defensible. Like other cultists, you defend the organization over truth and integrity (cf. Mormons). When objective questioning happens, people are kicked out. This is why they remain locked in rank heresy.

  62. godrulz37

    The meetings are open, but they will follow you around like KGB if you are not a Witness and question things (they will also kick you out of conventions, etc., if you converse with people using Kingdom Interlinear…I know this from experience). In the meetings, leading questions are used with WT literature that misquotes credible sources. People are discouraged from just reading the Bible apart from WT literature, learning Greek, having independent Bible studies, etc. This is confirmed by letters from GB, things that happened at Bethel in the 80s, etc. There are also insiders that lead secret letters, elder policies, pedophilia handling, kangaroo court disfellowshipping secret meetings, etc. You do not realize how much mind and information control goes on from this authoritarian organization. Only when they are exposed will they start to back peddle. Malawi vs Mexico fiasco, pyramids, etc. etc.

  63. Anonymous

    You know what, we can throw opinions back and forth to each other all day and it will still not change my view of jws and vise versa. In the end people are gonna do as they please. If someone wants to be a jw and practice and share that belief then just let them. People have free will. Get over it. Focus on your own life and your own imperfections and just quit bothering people. Your disturbing me with all the ridicule and bitterness towards them and I’m not even a jw.

  64. Anonymous

    I do not believe in activist such as yourselves. All you are doing is bashing people when the one you should be bashing is yourself. That is the problem with society today. If only hitler had looked in a mirror and changed his thinking so many people wouldn’t have died and if satan hadn’t became who he became so many people wouldn’t be who they are today.

  65. Anonymous

    Proverbs 18:7
    The mouth of the stupid is his ruin, And his lips are a snare for his life.

  66. Ann

    Yep. Jehovah’s Witnesses are the modern day equivalent of the Pharisees of Christ’s day. The Pharisees would throw fits and rip their garments in anger. They were hotheaded and they were constantly plotting to trick Christ into saying something He didn’t mean to say. They even made things up about Him just to justify their harsh treatment of Him or anyone who gave him any credibility whatsoever.

    I actually find this to be harsh. In many ways what you said could also be applied to yourself Doug. The fact that you make up lies and present fake documents to people found online that possibly even you created for instance the letter written to natiz when the original can clearly be seen in the Washington museum. You criticize everyone that actually has good things to say about the Jws to the point of name calling and verbal abuse. Does that not defeat the purpose of the” like it or hate it?” Feedback section. If all your going to do is take a stand for what you believe and make nasty comments to people who disagree. Why have a comment feed? This blog is breaking a lot of rules of WordPress. I’ve seen many copyright issues regarding this site, infringements and abuse on this page and I really think it deserves reporting.

  67. godrulz37

    We have a mandate to defend and proclaim truth. It would be unloving for us not to speak truth in love in light of the eternal consequences.

  68. Ed

    i sincerely believe many intelligent I (i know a few intelligent Elders) JW’s know the truth about the many false and twisted doctrines.yet, they are in too deep! Their wives, children, relatives and close friends are also looking to them. They are Pillars in the congregations. They simply cannot walk away! They have too much to lose.. or so they think!

  69. Nobody here is bashing JW’s William. Most of us WERE JW’s at one time. This is a blog designed to help those who are unhappy in the group or who have encountered problems as a result of being in or related to the Jehovah’s Witnesses in some way.

    This perceived bashing is primarily because of the abrasive and confrontational JW visits that occasionally happen. They come in and post all over the place, pick fights, and generally make a nuisance of themselves.

    Doug

  70. I’ll defer to my prior response to your same post. You seem to be repeating yourself William.

  71. And they make you feel guilty for not wanting to do what THEY want you to do. That’s normal and you’ll just have to deal with it. Learn to distance yourself from the drama and realize that this is just a passing phase of life. You’ll be out of that before you know it and on to the rest of your life.

    Doug

  72. It was flattering. Rutherford very clearly demonstrated that he was in agreement with their anti-Semitic views as well as their hatred for the Anglo American world power i.e. the United States and England.

    Also, I never said that Jehovah’s Witnesses were violent. However I did say that if you challenge their views instead of “rolling over” for their theocratic intrusions that they will get angry and animated and in many cases hateful.

    I’ve seen it as many have on this blog. The verbal thrashings I’ve received on this blog are a case in point.

    Are you a JW posing as a disinterested third party because it certainly appears to me that you are?

    Doug

  73. A very insightful point Godrulz37! Jehovah’s Witnesses will try to latch on to any persecution as proof that they are “the only true religion”. Then they square off and openly condemn all other religions as “Satanic” and part of “Babylon The Great”. You are absolutely right! Many more died in the concentration camps of Nazi Germany than Jehovah’s Witnesses. If you used the standard JW logic then we’d all have to say that Judaism is the only true religion based upon the amount of persecution the Jews have suffered!

    Doug

  74. This is the old JW shell game by the way. When called out on their misapplication of logic they back up and eloquently say: “I didn’t MEAN it that way.” My mother is a MASTER at that as are most of the JW’s that I know or knew.

  75. Well if the JW’s are teaching a false and counterfeit Christianity, and I maintain that they are, then the churches are doing exactly what Christ commissioned them to do and that is to care for their flock.

  76. So you attend other churches? I thought that was a JW “no no”.

  77. FYI: The word is VATICAN not vadicin. The Catholic church is far from perfect as are all the rest of them. I don’t subscribe to ANY organized religion and my primary reason is that I won’t allow a man or group of men to dictate to me how I am to serve my God, treat my fellow man, or what I can or cannot be, do or have.

  78. Agree on all points Godrulz37!

  79. Yep. Amen Godrulz37!

  80. Point of order Anonymous: YOU CAME TO MY HOUSE not the other way around. I didn’t drop in on your local Kingdom Hall and start talking to you. YOU CAME HERE and YOU started throwing your opinions at us. When you do that in MY HOUSE get ready to be CHALLENGED on all points. If the heat gets too hot for you…get out of the kitchen!

    Doug

  81. Do you really hear yourself? You go out and bash every other religion and tell everybody around you that they’re wrong and you accuse US of bashing? REALLY? Your hypocrisy and lack of coherence is staggering Anonymous!

  82. Nice scripture. You should read it sometime.

  83. Oh wow. Really? So now it comes down to reporting me? Go ahead there Ann. Don’t you think if the WT could have shut me down they would have already done it? Take your best shot and don’t miss sweetheart!

  84. FYI: Because you came and started blowing up my blog my hit count yesterday was the best it’s ever been in the history of my blog! Thank you Anonymous for making this page infinitely more popular than it would have been without you.

    You see when you JW’s come on here and start throwing rocks it draws traffic to the site. That creates buzz. It improves my search engine results on engines like Google. That creates even more buzz and makes this site even more beneficial in helping people out of the JW’s than it ever would have been without you. I can’t imagine how many doors you’re going to have to knock on to cool Jehovah’s wrath down after all of the damage you’ve done to His organization by visiting my blog and helping me achieve even greater results than I ever would have otherwise.

    So again: THANK YOU!

    Doug

    PS: If you’re truly repentant you’ll have to go report yourself to the body of elders otherwise Jehovah just won’t forgive you and you’ll die at Armageddon! (He said in an ominous theocratic tone.)

  85. Ed

    Amen Brother Doulas! Anon has been inbibin’ of the WT cool aide a bit too much. It was fun and entertaining while it lasted. Regards, My Brother

  86. Ed

    I see public reproof in Anons future! 🙂

  87. LOL! I think you’re quite right Ed. However, it would be so much better for her if she swallowed her pride and just approached all of this with a spirit of good humor and a little curiosity. I know she thinks she’s completely right in her assumptions but what if I’m right? What if I’m just HALF right? Why would people who have some intelligence completely abandon the organization unless they have a very good reason?

  88. Ed

    Curiosity is what will lead to her salvation. Consider the other side of argument carefully.. As if your life depended on it, cuz it does. They simply refuse, continue to drink and remain oblivious to logic, history, archeology, scripture, common sense, the opinions of highly educated men without an agenda. I find it unbelievable.. Almost comical yet sad.

  89. Thank God that we have escaped Ed. Can you imagine how empty and meaningless our lives would have been had we not left the organization when we did? I shudder to think about it!

  90. Ed

    How do I send attachments? I hav som articles i think you would benefit from. One is the death of Jesus a medical perspective. An excellent an very deep paper by med community.

  91. You can email them to me Ed.

    I don’t allow attachments on this site because these pesky JW’s would litter the blog with scans of their propaganda and count it as a book placement!

    😛

  92. Ed

    Don’t know how to send via this site. I hav them on my LT vs phone. Ok to text email to 805.441.5217? So will not be public.

  93. Garrett

    Doug,
    When I look over ALL this dialogue. ALL the words, ALL the combat, EVERYTHING…I can’t think how courageous and time consuming it is on your part to do this. You put your face and real name out there for all to see and you let people post who you would like to see go away.

    I contrast this with the Watchtower Society. Go to their website and there is no forum. There is no website to write in with questions or complaints. All you can do is fill out the form “Would You Like a Visit?”. New York then
    takes that sales lead and hands it over to a couple of local flunkies in the congregation to make the call.
    The Watchtower Society HIDES behind the local congregations the way a Mafia boss sends out his errand boys and hit men.

    I even contacted a Muslim scholar online once. He was famous and people wrote in on a forum with all their questions. You could read others questions and his response. I wrote in a question about the Koran and my answer came back online for all to read.

    This Muslim gave me far better service than my old religion of JWs ever did even though the muslims number close to a billion and the good old boys in Brooklyn would only have a fraction of that populous to deal with.

    Shame on the Governing Body for being such cowards, refusing TV interviews and not answering their own parishioners without handing them over to their own elders to be dealt with.

  94. Thanks Garrett!

    Sigh…I do allow people to post on here that we would all rather not hear from. It does serve to show curious visitors just how ingrained and indoctrinated the Jehovah’s Witness belief system is and just how unreasonable they are when involved in any confrontation regarding beliefs. These JW “assassins” don’t realize that their very presence on here and their condescending and accusatory dialogue gives them away as the narrow minded, hostile, blowhards they are.

    Did I mention that they can’t spell? I mean NONE of them can spell. Have you noticed that? What the heck? Do they know that spellcheck exists or is that another apostate conspiracy?

    You would think that of all their mindless hours dawdling in the Kingdom Halls rattling the pages of their New World Translation while brother holier-than-thou prattles on about how good the Watchtower society is and how bad all other religions are, that they would have AT LEAST learned how to spell.

    “Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.” The Wizard of Oz

    Apparently that isn’t the only thing they fail to pay attention to.

    With regard to the Watchtower leadership you couldn’t be more accurate in your assessment.

    They simply won’t come out for interviews or public debate. Why? Because they KNOW what would happen. They KNOW that the whole world KNOWS their history because it is easily accessible to anyone who bothers to look. Apparently the only people who aren’t aware of their checkered past and their faulty theology are their own followers who choose to remain blissfully ignorant.

    Doug

  95. Just email me Ed! I can accept attachments at dougshields1@cox.net.

  96. Alicia

    Doug,

    I’ve noticed that too when cruising the posts on your blog, many JW’s can’t spell very well! I also watch a lot of JW fairytale videos on YouTube & you should see the staggering amount of misspellings littered all over the comments section!

  97. Most Jehovah’s Witnesses barely have any education at all and I pity them. Education equals empowerment and the Watchtower leadership frowns heavily on anyone getting a degree. Much better to just “work for Jehovah” until the end comes rather than getting a worldly degree. Degrees are pretty much worthless in the “new system” you know. I remember many sisters telling my mother that I would never graduate high school because the “new system” would be here in just a few months (prior to 1975). Funny how that seems like just yesterday yet it has been almost forty years ago!

    After living the first half of my life with Armageddon “just around the corner” I decided to live a life with all of my hopes and dreams “just around the corner” instead. It has been a wonderful ride. I’m thankful to God for giving me the wisdom to see through all of the deception of the Watchtower teachings and the fortitude to make my decision to get off “the bus that never arrives.”

    I see lots of good people on that bus. They don’t look too happy to me. They look tired, and frail and worried.

    I’m standing at the bus stop. I’m waving at them as they go by day after day. Perhaps one day, soon, they’ll choose to get off that bus and maybe, just maybe, we can have a real conversation.

    I’d like that.

    Doug

  98. Alicia

    I had my meeting today with the witness couple. It went well & they were very nice. Although I have to say when I mentioned my doubt regarding the credibility of the governing body, they began to compare them to “the faithful men of old who were put in place by God to take the lead” and of course familiar, predictable scriptures such as Proverbs 4:18 ( the light gets brighter) & Matthew 24:45 (faithful & discreet slave) were read to me. I still feel that those scriptures alone do not prove the GB are God’s sole channel on earth. I even brought up the bedroom law WT articles of the 70’s & they said there’s a reason why that information hasn’t been updated since then. At least they did admit that there’s nothing in the scriptures that condemn certain acts between married couples and that some people can be over zealous and try to push their restrictive conscience on others. I wanted to tell them how the governing body had broke up many marriages over this in the past, but I didn’t get too deep into it. Maybe next time. In a way, an article needs to be published to set the record straight and I feel that the organization needs to take more accountability for the damage they have caused in people’s lives. I also talked about how many witnesses sold their homes & left their savings to the Watchtower when they were told that 1975 would be the dawn of Armageddon, but they never heard of that. Also, I mentioned how their baptism dedication changed in either 1985 or 1986 to include “spirit-directed organization” & the lady asked me if it was something I read off the internet cuz she never knew it changed, she was baptized in 1992. Their closing thoughts were: “whose conduct is in line with the bible & who else is going door to door helping people to understand the bible?”

    Let me know what you think about this, Doug.

  99. Alicia

    Great post, Doug! It should make many JW’s contemplate who they’re really living their life for. They’ll say Jehovah, but it’s plain to see that the old guys of the Watchtower society are the ones in control. I loved your analagy to the bus that never arrives because it’s so true! I don’t hold any degree, but I’ve always believed in keeping myself educated & informed on a variety of subjects. History was one of my favorite classes, so maybe this is why I have dug so deep into Watchtower history and done plenty of research on my own terms outside the organization.

    I forgot to mention one other thing the elder & his wife said to me before they left today: “We want you on that figurative ark before this old system ends!”

  100. Pretty much the standard line of reasoning Alicia. And let me say that they are most likely totally sincere in their attempt to “help” you.

    Two things that helped me to realize what was happening to me when I was in. First was my real determination to prove the Jehovah’s Witnesses right by reading the New Testament for myself. I figured that if the New Testament (not the NWT) backed them up to the letter then it was the truth and nothing but. However, when I read the New Testament (Not the NWT) it raised a lot more questions about what I had been taught. Specifically, the divinity or non-divinity of Christ. The existence of an actual hell or not. The trinity or not. The separation of the two classes of Jehovah’s Witnesses and was that actually the case or was the Governing Body reading way too much into the reference to the “other sheep” class. The fact is that after I read the complete New Testament I realized that working for God was not what saved me. (Romans 8) I found out that Christ was in fact part of God and was worshipped by His disciples on several occasions and referred to Himself as God on many occasions. I found out that there is way too much description of hell as a place of fire and torment for it to be just a metaphor as the Watchtower had led me to believe. I also found it absolutely stunning that the reference to the “other sheep” by Christ was nothing more than a reference to the inclusion of the gentiles into the largely Jewish Christian congregation (Acts). The Christian congregation is truly ONE FLOCK and ONE SHEPHERD not two separate classes of Christian. I read many references to the Holy Spirit and how He can be grieved. He can teach. He can lead. That seemed to me to be more like a person than some mindless force like electricity. I also read about Christ preaching to the spirits in prison. Nobody had ever been able to explain that scripture to me and when I read it in context it made perfect sense. I figured out that these were lost souls who had not crossed over yet otherwise what would be the point in preaching to them? Christ was merely leading them to the light. I also figured out that people who died prior to Christ’s ascension and were resurrected, couldn’t die, although I had always been taught that they could. I read where Stephen prayed to Jesus to accept his spirit as he was being stoned. I read where Jesus Christ is the Alpha and the Omega spoken of in Revelation. I then read John 8:58 and realized that Christ truly is God.

    These are all scriptures that I had read over and over before while I was a Jehovah’s Witness but I never gave it much thought. I was too busy focusing on this “new system” and all of the activity I had to perform in order to “get there”. I realized that mine was a transactional spirituality. I had been taught that if I worked hard enough and knocked on enough doors and attended enough meetings that “probably maybe” God would spare me when Armageddon came. I found out in my reading of Romans that work isn’t required at all for salvation. All I had to have was faith and that faith in God would blossom into it’s own set of works and not some “prescribed and contrived” set of activities that would gain me safe passage into the “new system”. I knew on a very visceral level that I was saved by the blood of Christ and that alone was sufficient. I learned that nothing that I could ever do would ever make me good enough. Only faith in Christ and His sacrifice was what saved me and nothing else.

    I figured out that the Jehovah’s Witnesses have a very different belief system from that taught in the Bible and I knew that on a conscious level.

    Then I read Steven Hassan’s book Combatting Cult Mind Control and it was like a thunderbolt hit me. Even though the book doesn’t even mention Jehovah’s Witnesses and the author never was one, I knew on a conscious and subconscious level that everything the Watchtower taught was part of a mind control indoctrination program that borrowed heavily from other authoritarian organizations through history.

    Knowing that the organization has done stupid and dishonest things never worked to sway me much. However it was an indicator that there might be more if I kept digging. When I realized all of this and had dug deeply enough it was time for me to leave and move on with my life.

    Doug

  101. godrulz37

    Like Raymond Franz, you had a ‘Crisis of Conscience’ to follow God/Word or men. Unlike Franz (as far as I know), you came to worship the real Jesus.

  102. Jodie

    Doug this was a very accurate post. It is amazing that even as you wrote about how hateful and confrontational Jehovah’s Witnesses become when presented with quotes from their own literature, posters on your blog start spewing the usual hate filled accusations about lying. There is something about this and every other cult out there that appeals to people. I think it is that “We are the only ones with the Truth.” sort of exceptionalism that appeals to Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses alike. They do not really know their organization’s history because they don’t want to know it. Instead they call anyone who brings up the organization’s history a liar. They do not know all of the doctrines nor can they explain the ones they do know without memorizing a passage from a Watchtower or other literature. This makes any doctrinal discussions futile. I do not know how many times I would discuss some doctrine with my mother and while I am quoting the Bible she is quoting Watchtowers. It is not productive. To put perspective on things we have to remember there is not a single scripture that identifies Jesus as being Michael the Archangel. Yet that is what the Jehovah’s Witnesses believe because that is what they have been told to believe from their Watchtowers. Those same Watchtowers also tell Jehovah’s Witnesses not to believe any of the very explicit Scriptures that identify Jesus as being God.They are very deceived people.I pray for them very day.

  103. godrulz37

    This is why Randall Watters http://www.freeminds.org came to realize the mind control/WT authority must be broken before they can be reasoned with from Scripture. I am somewhat old school and still trust the Spirit and Word, but the mind control really is a problem (in addition to demonic deception).

  104. Ed

    Doug, My Brother. Forgive Anon.. “for she knows not what shes does.. says.. or has actually signed up for” The WT Cool Aide has blinded her mental status.

  105. Thanks Jodie!

    Amazing how they didn’t realize what they were doing when they started in on me. They were making my point FOR ME without realizing it.

    Oh and you are absolutely right! There is no scripture in the Bible that states that Christ is Michael the archangel. JW’s just “take it on faith” but faith in their beloved Watchtower and not the scriptures!

    Doug

  106. You are absolutely right! You can reason from the scriptures until you’re blue in the face and you won’t get anywhere with JW’s. The only way is to deal with the programming first and THEN show them the real truth about God.

    Doug

  107. She amused me quite a bit Ed. I enjoy sparring with a feisty JW every once in awhile. It gets a little boring sometimes and that definitely jazzed up the room didn’t it? LOL!

    Doug

  108. Ed

    Douglas, Ya’re jes plain ORNERY!! Ya’ best behave yer’self lest.. ya’ git struck down with Leprosy or sump-em’!! 🙂

  109. Ed

    I was communicating with one of the “head” Elders in my Cong. A Pillar and very intelligent, good man. After I started asking questions and sending him articles exposing WT via email he blocked me. I asked why? He claimed he did’nt hav clue. To this day, 1 yr later, I am blocked from sending.

  110. Seth Richardson

    Doug, I agree with Garrett. Thank you for your work here. Sadly, I was as venomous as the JW’s leaving the ‘unkind’ remarks on this thread. It wasn’t until the “two witness” policy personally affected ME that I had to question this organization. I, like the ones commenting here thought I knew the Bible. I debated numerous pastors, etc and was an MS in the congregation for 15 years until the day I disassociated which came as a shock to many because I was still serving in the congregation, giving public talks, etc. I had started to research ‘doctrine’ and this is the sole reason I left. The Watchtower has set themselves in the place of Christ. Sadly, Witnesses don’t know the Bible, they know the Watchtower interpretation of the Bible and regardless of what any Witness may post to state otherwise, this is a fact! There are many fine people that are JW’s and I pray that they will wake up. I’m sure those who leave unkind remarks on this thread are fine people also, who are doing what they are trained to do. Thank you again for your blog!
    *disclaimer* all grammatical errors are due to the lack of education I could pursue as a JW

    Seth

  111. godrulz37

    It is true that JWs read the Bible through the eyes of WT literature and will quote its responses even if they really do not understand them or have not checked out the misquotes of scholars, etc. We need to read the WT literature through the eyes of the Bible with a credible translation, not sectarian perversion NWT.

  112. Doug, Garrett, godrulz37, + Seth Richardson – You are ALL so right. In reality, THE real education is right here. THE TRUTH! Unbiased, unadulterated, unedited( sort of ), uncensored. Again, sort of. However, here is where I find DIRECTION towards the real Truth. Little bits and pieces if you observe closely, listen diligently, comprehend, understand and follow up in that lead. Sometime, even frequently, these Truths are blatantly stated. Hard to miss. I LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!

  113. Oops. Hey, Doug, I need your edited skills. I spelt TRUTH wrong! Sorry. Thanks, if you get an opportunity to correct. I would appreciate it. Thanks, my Friend.

  114. Oops. Typos abound! I really need some help. Sorry.

  115. Hey you guys. I just noticed that’s it’s August already and my fifty seventh birthday is the twelfth. I think I aught to at least attempt to celebrate my birthday this year. I think the day that God permitted our creation aught to be honored in some form or way. What do you guys think?

  116. Seth Richardson

    Happy Birthday 🙂

  117. Happy Birthday Karyne! Go out and do something for yourself that you wouldn’t ordinarily do. Something that makes YOU feel good about YOU!

    Jehovah’s Witnesses are taught to subjugate anything outside of the “approved activity” that gives them personal pride, value and makes them feel good about themselves.

    What did you want to do when you were a little girl? What did you never get to do because you were too busy being “good enough”?

    Go do that and make a record of it! Video yourself. Post it on your blog or Facebook! Tell all your friends about it and then let those wonderful feelings wash over you. I’ll warn you. It’s addictive and you’ll soon be doing other awesome things with your life that have nothing to do with anyone’s “approved” list but YOUR’S!

  118. Duly noted and corrected Karyne! I also corrected “blantent”. 🙂 Yeah I’m sort of a spelling snob. LOL!

  119. The main thing this blog gives all of us is the ability to speak our minds freely and without fear (something we NEVER experienced in the Jehovah’s Witness religion!) Obviously I don’t allow posting a bunch of “copy and paste” Watchtower BS. However, we do allow honest conversation and even outright arguments. If it is a real argument and conversation then it goes right here. However, just posting cryptic BS from the Watchtower CD because you’re too cowardly to formulate your own line of reasoning isn’t what we’re after. We all have the bound volumes. We all have the Aid Book. What we WANT is an honest and open and REAL conversation. That is where truth, real truth, resides.

    Hey if you FEEL a certain way it is YOUR TRUTH regardless of what other people say or do. That was the one thing I couldn’t stomach in the JW’s was the fact that I was always being told to pay no attention to my own feelings and thoughts because they would “lead me astray”. Actually they led me to freedom! Ignoring that little voice of truth inside of our heads is a sure way to fall for someone else’s falsehoods (aka BS)!

    Doug

  120. Doug,
    Touché!! So VERY, VERY WELL SAID. I believe, that right here, because of you, Doug, we’re permitted to express our TRUE feelings and BELIEFS. They can be assessed, explored, debated, even PASSIONATELY !! All in an attempt to gain the TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH!! Thanks, Doug. Quite an awesome task and responsibility that you shoulder quite well for all our benefit!!!

  121. Thanks Karyne!

  122. Ed

    Karyne be sure not to have anyone killed during your birthday celebration 🙂

  123. Haha! Ed your sense of humor is quite warped which is why I like you so much.

    Doug

  124. Ed

    Thanks My Bro! Ya’ mean warped in a good way.. Right? Warped minds think alike! Luv ya!

  125. Yes “warped” was a huge compliment!

    Back at you Ed!

    Doug

  126. Ed

    Doug, My Brother. I read your reply to Donald, the 17 year old young man living with his Parents.Your article: “Advice For Jehovah’s Witness Teens” is filled with great advice. Good job, my Friend. I pray that Donald will endure until he is able to leave home and live a truly satisfying life. I recall many young Brothers at assemblies and KH’s over the years. I hope some gained the intelligence like Donald and became or will become successful,fulfilled adults. I pray my Grandsons will too.

  127. There is always hope Ed!

    With God all things are possible.

  128. Ed

    Jesus forgive me please. but…Douglas, Keep makin’ them gnash ther’ teeth!

  129. John

    Hi Doug,
    Out mowing a lawn for some people the other day and here come 4 guys 2 on each side of the street. Not sure who they were, but 2 of them pasted right in front of me while I was mowing. Without saying a word they walked by and I stopped mowing and said ” what are yo guys up to?” trying to find who they were and what they were doing. Yep, JW’s. the more experienced one told me they were just handing out literature door to door about a website which has free literature for anybody. So I asked him about “why now”? why not years ago? He says because of technology. I told him the technology has been here for years and “you guys are the Witnesses to the World” what took you so long? He quickly shrugged me off as a debater and they went on their way. I guess I wasn’t worth the trouble….to witness to.

  130. Ed

    Howdy Brother John,

    Lesson:

    1. Don’t mow your lawn.
    2. If ya’ must mow your lawn, mow it during the week. After work
    3. if you want to be a “Debater” then DEBATE! its so very simple. They (JDubs) do not have a clue re. truth.
    4, Do not allow them to walk away, we need to rescue them from the WTBTS.

    Regards,

    Brother Ed

  131. LOL! Will do sir!

    Doug

  132. You’re just a “goat” John! LOL! That question was above his pay grade.

    Good for you! More people need to call them out on their own BS! Great job sir!

    Doug

  133. You block and we’ll tackle! LOL!

  134. John

    You guys are serious and funny..seriously funny.

  135. Ed

    John, Bahhh..bahhh… ba..ba.. bahhhh baa,,baa!! (Ya’ big bad Goat!)

  136. Jodie

    Today I was thinking of a conversation I had with my mother a few years ago about the Jehovah’s Witnesses doctrine that one must belong to their organization in order to receive salvation. I asked her what scripture commanded that. She took a deep breath and began “The Bible contains truths as well as deep truths.” I stopped her because I knew she was quoting a Watchtower and asked her to tell me which scripture in the Bible gave the commandment that one must join an organization in order to receive salvation. She could not tell me a single scripture. Instead she told me that “God had always used just one organization.” So I asked her, “What about Nebuchadnezzar?” I then quoted to her from Jeremiah 27 where God says he is the Creator of the earth and everything on it and he gives it to whomever he pleases. And in that case it pleased him to give everything to “His Servant Nebuchadnezzar.” I asked my mother,”Wasn’t Nebuchadnezzar an idol worshipper who later came to recognize the”Most High God”? My mother told me that was not a good example because God was punishing his one true organization. I asked her then, “When Jesus came to earth which organization did he choose his disciples from?” My mother answered, “They were all Jewish.” I told her I know that they were all Jewish but the Jewish people had divided themselves into sects in much the same way that modern-day Christians have divided themselves into sects. “When you say one must find the right organization and serve God as part of it what you are really saying is one must find the right “sect” and serve God as part of it.” By the way Paul was a Pharasee. Simon Peter was a Zealot. My mother said I was making this too complicated and that Jehovah was a God of order not disorder therefore he could only use one organization. I then said, “You know Mom that kind of sounds like you are making up rules for God and I don’t think God would be too happy about that. I am of the mind that God can do as he pleases because he’s well…God. If God wants to prophecy through an ass he can.”

  137. Very well said Jodie and He DID prophesy through an ass.

    Christ said that God could “make the stones cry out” if He chose. I’m reminded of the following scripture:

    Luke 9:49-50

    John answered and said, “Master, we saw someone casting out demons in Your name; and we tried to prevent him because he does not follow along with us.” But Jesus said to him, “Do not hinder him; for he who is not against you is for you.”

    This scripture alone states flatly that it isn’t necessary for us to be part of some specific sect and that we can all worship God in our own way as we best understand Him.

    Another fantastic scripture that confirms this is:

    Matthew 18:20

    For where two or three gather in my name, there am I with them.”

    Note that both of these instances were Christ’s own words.

    Doug

  138. John

    I don’t see where Christ’s own words are superior to any other scripture “words”, but I too find myself emphasizing when Christ has said something to make the point that Christ Himself said it. He is the word that became flesh and dwelt among us. PTL .
    I appreciate you guys even though I did not find myself in JW’s cult but another. Freedom through Christ and in Christ is FREEDOM period!

  139. Seth Richardson

    Amen and boomshagala

  140. Christ was the Reason for the Bible to be written. It’s always been about Him so I guess I tend to put a LOT more import on His words than anyone else’s. Just my take.

    Doug

  141. Alicia

    Hi Jodie,

    Very well said! It’s amazing how much emphasis witnesses place on God having a so-called chosen organization, yet there’s not a shred of scriptural evidence to back up this absurd claim!! It seems that the “God has always had an organization” line is the typical & tired answer that most witnesses will resort to when put under pressure trying to prove that God needs his “visible organization on earth”. That scripture about God being a God of order not disorder is also one I’ve heard way too many times before. Ugh. My husband is an unbaptized publisher, but he’s deeply indoctrinated because he was brought up in the “truth” and since he is so influenced by the Watchtower, it is very hard to get any point across without him feeling attacked or under “persecution in Satan’s system”. It’s a big challenge to be married to a man that never feels the need to question the integrity of the governing body’s decisions, no matter how blatantly wrong they are.

  142. Alicia

    Happy Friday Doug!

    I found an audio clip on YouTube of governing body member Samuel Herd saying some really degrading things about women. It was pitiful and I don’t see how any witness could defend this man’s ridiculous views. I would like to share it here, but since I access this site from my android it might be easier for me to send it to you via email and then you could post it up for everybody.

  143. Ed

    Jodie, According to WTBT Society:

    AWAKE! SEPTEMBER 2013
    This explains the words at Hebrews 10:24, 25, where the Bible says: “Let us consider one another to incite to love and fine works, not forsaking the gathering of ourselves together.” In fact, the Scriptures state that true worshippers would render worship as brothers and sisters, united as a figurative body.

    Should you dismiss all organized religion?
    The Bible describes that body, or congregation, as being united by a bond of love and peace. For instance, Ephesians 4:2, 3 admonishes true worshippers to act “with complete lowliness of mind and mildness, with long-suffering, putting up with one another in love, earnestly endeavoring to observe the oneness of the spirit in the uniting bond of peace.” How could you comply with this admonition if your worship were independent and detached from other worshippers?
    It is God’s will that instead of being a loose association of spiritually-minded individuals, true worshipers merge into a tight community of faith. The Bible exhorts worshipers to speak in agreement, to avoid divisions, and to be “fitly united in the same mind and in the same line of thought.” (1 Corinthians 1:10) Those words would make little sense if God wanted people to worship him only as individuals apart from one another.
    Clearly, evidence from the Bible points to an organized form of worship as the kind that is acceptable to God. And the organized religion that the Scriptures describe, the one that God sponsors, can give you the support you require to be successful in satisfying your spiritual needs.—Matthew 5:3.
    3 “Happy are those conscious of their spiritual need,*+ since the Kingdom of the heavens belongs to them.
    Granted, many organized religions today are guilty of hypocrisy and countless atrocities. Yet, this does not mean that you should repudiate all organized religion. There must be a religion on earth that is organized to show love to all people—a religion that is organized to educate others about God’s moral principles. Such an organized religion can help you to build genuine faith. The Bible provides the necessary clues that can help you to identify the kind of organized worship that is acceptable to God.

    (Sorry Doug i know you do not like cut n paste info)

    I can’t speak for the church you attend, but my church North County Fellowship, fits this description. We are fitly united, we speak in agreement, happy and conscious of our spiritual need..Etc.In fact we fellowship with many churches within the community with this same spirit..We show love to all people. We educate people of the truth about Jesus.

    When i was attending the KH, we absolutely did not fellowship with any other churches. We were taught they were all misled by Satan himself.We did not show love to those people. How can you show love and accuse them of worshiping Satan?

  144. Ed

    Alicia, Information from the GB or WTBTS is considered as “gospel” or inspired. To question them is to question God Himself! In spite of the obvious errors , failed predictions..Etc.. they are simply blind to all this!

  145. Alicia

    You got it, Ed. This is exactly how a witness thinks. They really feel that if you disagree with the governing body aka “God’s only channel on earth” then they equate that to rejecting God. It seems that they place equal importance on the Watchtower leaders as they do God. I just can’t justify their reasoning on that one.

  146. Ed

    Few can justify. Not even them! They will say they are following God. Never admitting the position GB holds in their mind and heart. “We worship Jehovah, not man!” Yet they blindly follow and treat every word written in WT by some old guys in NY as inspired, I cannot even have an adult, civil conversation with my wife about this or anything related without conflict. She “gnashes her teeth” in anger! Refusing to speak (yell & accuse me, yes) of listen. She could be a Pioneer,spend all day talking to me, counting the time!!!! She would not need to pile 5 to a car, drive around doing RV’s leaving mags under door mats, speak to maybe.. 2 people? and the entire group chalks up 2 hours each! Some in the car may not even get out of the car! Comical how they count time. Chalk up the hours.. lest you become inactive!!

  147. Garrett

    I think the best punishment I can think of to hand out to the Governing Body and Jehovahs Witnesses
    Is to let them continue on as Jehovahs Witnesses. They have to suffer all the confusion of false prophesies, and the pain of not getting a college education, having to deal with narrow minded pain in the ass elders, being engaged in a crushing schedule of meetings , assemblies and service….I could go on.

    It’s like when you you see someone throw a cigarette out the window and you say ” I could kill the bastard” …..it’s then you realize he is paying huge tax on those cigarettes and killing himself for you….

    Rather nifty eh?

  148. Send it to me at dougshields1@cox.net and I’ll post it on the site.

    Thanks Alicia!

  149. Amen! (And I will overlook the “cut and paste” issue in this instance because you did it to make an actual point instead of going “vomitus eruptus” like some JW’s that like to pull a drive by on this site.)

    While I don’t attend any specific church I have attended many and all of them that I have encountered preach from the word, they call on the name of Christ and they all are UPLIFTING rather than DOWNGRADING.

    Thanks,

    Doug

  150. True that!

    Doug

  151. Well the first thing they do is to take Christ off of His exalted position and they place themselves on His throne. They erroneously state that Christ is merely an archangel and not God and therefore maintain that the authority is vacant. How convenient! All and I mean ALL destructive so called “Christian” cults operate in the same manner. They all strip away the power and the authority from Christ and give it to themselves.

    Doug

  152. If you took all the hours they spend actually talking to an interested person about the Bible and compare them to the hours they spend gossiping about each other I think you would find an interesting ratio.

  153. You are so right as always Garrett!

  154. My Gosh!!!!! I so love reading this forum. Everyone here articulates MY VIEWS ALMOST PERFECTLY!!!!! Doug, Alicia, Ed, Garrett, the list goes on. The articulation of my exact views is incredible! The positive of exchange of ideas is truly up lifting. The other day, I had my bible study with my witness Friends. Mind you NOT FROM MY CONGREGATION THAT I ATTEND! I find no real Christians there NOR have I attended there in some time. However, one of my friends repeated what a friend of hers said. This individual is a JW from my congregation. This comment was actually, when you boiled it down, a “criticism” of me. Based upon hearsay, third hand information that I equated to the bibles description of GOSSIP! I was furious and ended up stated quite adamantly that these so called “Christians” were NOTHING BUT! After they departed I was pissed, fixed my dinner and RENTED THE NOAH MOVIE TO WATCH! The recent movie with Russell Crow banished by the JW’s! Why? Did they see it ? NO! So how do they legitimately critique it? So I watched it! It was great! It’s a damn movie! It was very entertaining. No it wasn’t a National Geographical Documentary. I’m unaware of anybody that claimed it was. It was however, A MOVIE, A TWO HOUR LONG MOVIE. If you read the account in the bible, how long would it actually take you? Fifteen minutes, maybe? It’s been rendered into a five minute story to repeat to our children. Naturally, anybody with a lick of common sense would realize that in order to create a two hour movie, you’d need to use some degree of imagination to make the “story come alive”. Is this not what the JW GB states in their introduction to every single dramatic bible reading that they publish for everyone’s consumption? Well that’s what the HOLLYWOOD SCREEN WRITERS DID!!!!! That’s what they were supposed to do. It’s a damn movie! However, it made sense and answered EVERY SINGKE QUESTION YOU COULD POSSIBLY IMAGINE!!!!! For me I could never reconcile Noah’s drunkenness during the story AFTER they were in dry land! This story provided a possible, obviously imaginative backdrop to this story. No shit Sherlock, it’s not in the bible. God provided what we need to know. It’s somewhat left for men to make sense of it, is it not? This movie had every single value, belief and doctrine that exists within the bible, within this movie. Why did God pick Noah, how and why given some of the things he did do, was deemed righteous by God, why did he so cruelly kill all on the earth? Well he didn’t. He had mercy for them. He gave them every opportunity! Was it hard? You bet it was. For both God and Noah’s family. How did they endure? How about the animals? How did they really built an ark for all these animal? Question after question is answered to the best if the screen writers imagination! It’s a movie! What rocket scientist JW decided they were justified in condemning a MOVIE THAT THEY DIDNT SEE? I thought it was phenomenal! See it if you like uplifting movies that bring biblical accounts to life! Be aware, though, this AINT A WORD FOR WORD ACCOUNT OF THE BIBLE! That would take fifteen minutes. Thanks for this forum. Gets out a lot of aggressive actions out by venting, complaining, bitching to people that UNDERSTAND! Thanks, from my heart to all of yours. I truly appreciate this invaluable opportunity, Doug and you guys. You, too, are invaluable!

  155. Thanks, you guys. Now I can have a wonderful day. With my God and you guys. The thanks that I can express simply aren’t sufficient for the knowledge that a I acquire here. However, I thank you and God, incessantly through out the day, in my little mind. It provides me with much joy. I’m finding the truth. Here, thanks to all that provide the recommendations of research into the TRUTH. Every single bit of advice that is posted here, aught to be explored, digested and finally assessed for Truth! Apostate? How do you assess Truth if you’re unaware of what the opposition states? Does it not warn in the bible we need to be aware of Satan’s schemes? If we don’t expose ourselves to their side of the argument? This forum explores for ALL to see and assess for themselves. Hebrews 5:24. “Train your perceptive powers.”
    Oops, the witnesses CHANGED that scripture in their recent NWT. I am unaware of what the new rendering is. Too, bad. Is it not? I have no faith that the GB is led by Holy Spirit of Gods organization! In my BOOK, FAITH IS A. PRODUCT OF FREE WILL! A little fact that the witnesses neglect to comprehend. Sad, is it not? WE can thank God we have the opportunity that we do, HERE! Thanks, again, Doug and all you guys. You’re great good strong reasonable, god fearing Christians, that only want to serve the God that they have cone to believe in.

  156. Alicia

    Thank you, Doug! I just sent you three audio clips of Samuel Herd, one of God’s “spirit-directed men” making a complete ass out of himself! I can’t wait until you posted so everyone can “witness” how awful this man is.

  157. Alicia

    Thank you, Karyne. I’m glad we could all help articulate some of your thoughts, feelings and frustration with the indoctrinated witness religion. I’ve been disillusioned with them for quite a while now and I only recently started speaking my mind about them which my husband doesn’t like.

  158. Bottom line: Jehovah’s Witnesses have a hard time accepting that anyone else can have a valid take on a Biblical event. Only the great and powerful Oz (the Governing Body) can interpret anything from the Bible. Everyone else is a Satanic poser and part of the worldwide conspiracy to mislead everyone.

    Doug

  159. Working on it now Alicia!

    Thanks for sharing those! I’ll have them up on the blog in no time.

    Doug

  160. You’ve come a long way Alicia. First you see a few things that aren’t “quite right”. Then you start to peel back the layers and see there are more things that aren’t right. Then you start to question the real motives behind everything the Watchtower states and it is THEN that you realize that it is part of a huge scam that defrauds, deceives, and delays what could be a full life well lived.

    Doug

  161. Ed

    Douglas my brother you should wear a hat wen in public to hide yer horns… Oh and tight pants to hide yer pointed tail!

  162. Jodie

    Ed,
    I am not for or against organized religion. Having grown up with both the Jehovah’s Witnesses (my Mom) and the Worldwide Church of God (my Dad),when I was given a choice in the matter I wanted no part of organized religion. It wasn’t because I didn’t believe in God but more like I was miffed at God for making religion so complicated. Having grown up believing there was no heaven or hell (a common doctrine of my parents’ religions) I felt that if and when Armageddon came I would die and then, well, what was the worst that was going to happen after that? I was going to go to sleep for all eternity? As a wife, mother of 2 and full time factory worker that proposition sounded mighty fine some days. It was about 5 or 6 years ago that I began studying the Bible trying to reason out the doctrines of the Jehovah’s Witnesses and this came about after I learned of the early history of the organization. In my studies I paid very close attention to the New Testament in order to better understand how the early Christians worshipped. What united the early Christians was their belief in and love for Christ. Christ was front and center. The Apostles tried to imitate Christ and tried to encourage others to do the same. In today’s churches, especially the big mega churches, it seems like Christ is missing. I realize now that it is not God who made religion complicated it is man who has made religion complicated. One thing that holds me back from joining an organized religion is that I do not believe we should be dividing ourselves into “sects”. My post earlier was not to condemn organized religion in general but rather to point to the Jehovah’s Witness unbiblical doctine that one has to find the correct organization and serve God as part of it in order to obtain salvation. To obtain salvation we need to follow Christ first and foremost not an organization.

  163. godrulz37

    Jn. 14:6; I Jn. 5:11-13; Rom. 10:9-10 Yes, person, not organization. WWCOG has moved toward orthodoxy, while WT is still heterodox.

  164. Ed

    Jodie, Re. Horns & Tail. I hope you know i was joking.I believe JW doctrines are full of non sense and errors. I joined without confirming what they were feeding me. I met a man while out in service many years ago named Steve. After years as a JW, i started asking questions and received poor answers from WTBTS and Elders. Steve is now my Pastor. The church i attend welcomes members from any church teaching basic, biblical truths. We are not divided. The name on the outside of the church does not matter. JW as you know, teach “us against them” and believe the only way to God is via WTBTS among others frivolous, unsupported and ridiculous doctrines. I’am sorry if i offended you. I agree with you: “To obtain salvation we need to follow Christ first and foremost not an organization”.

  165. Ed

    Jodie, After reviewing post history, i see which post you were replying about. I am writing in haste.. on my way out the door.. I believe we are on the “same page” Chat with ya’ later.. Ed

  166. Jodie

    No worries Ed. I was not even a tiny bit offended by your post.

  167. Alicia

    Thank you for the support, Doug! That means a lot coming from you. When I first started to discover facts about the unsavory history of the Watchtower Society, I didn’t want to accept the harsh reality about my newfound beliefs. I ignored that little voice inside my head for over a year until I just couldn’t bear to live a lie anymore and I knew I had to speak my mind. The answers I was receiving from my bible teachers and elders just seemed more like excuses and a poor attempt to sanitize Watchtower history. Your blog greatly helped me gather the courage I needed to finally take a stand against this organization. I still want to dig deeper into the bible for real truth, but I need to time to heal from the deception of the witness religion. I’m not ready yet to give it another shot, but hopefully one day I will be.

  168. Take your time with it Alicia.

    You’re just fine the way you are. You don’t have to be “this” or “that” you simply “are” and know what? God is fine with that! He’s there for you every single day and sometimes, just knowing that little truth gets me through the day. He knows not only where you’ve been but where you’re going. He knows who you are, who you’ve been, and who you will be and He loves you anyway. 🙂

    Doug

  169. I was TOTALLY offended! 🙂 Nah…I love your sense of humor Ed!

    Doug

  170. AMEN! Christ is the reason!

    Doug

  171. Anonymous

    Curious, do you believe Jehovah and Jesus are one and the same?

  172. I am just not sure if they are one and the same or just one in essence. There are so many scriptures that directly infer the close similarities between the two.

    For example:

    God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.'” Exodus 3:14

    “Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” John 8:58

    Now this might be a coincidence but it wasn’t one to the Jews because the next scripture explains how THEY took it to mean:

    At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.” John 8:59

    For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. Isaiah 9:6

    Note that He is called God and Father as well as Prince of Peace. I don’t think any JW would have the audacity to say that this was speaking about anyone else but Jesus Christ.

    I won’t presume to have direct knowledge of Jehovah’s thoughts like the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society does but I do own a Bible and it’s pretty clear to me that there are striking similarities between Christ of the New Testament and Jehovah of the Old Testament, so much so that it has led just about every single other Christian organization to consider them to be the same.

    I believe that Colossians 1:19 makes this even plainer:

    “For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him,”

    This is all enough to make even the most obtuse JW question their “assignment” of such a great personage as Jesus Christ to the title of archangel (Michael). There is simply NOTHING in the Old or New Testaments that would indicate such a belief or teaching and I believe that this goes “beyond the things written” and should be flatly rejected as Paul advised.

    Hope this helps answer your question Anonymous.

    Doug

  173. A 1975 Survivor

    Whenever I had Bible “Study” with the JWs couple, no matter how much evidence I presented to them according to the Scriptures, they would tell me what source of information did I get from and I said just the Bible alone. Then they said the NWT has most accurate rendition of the true word of Jehovah. So when I showed them that according to the Greek Interlinear there were no numerous Jehovah in the New Testament. Theey would go on saying who translated the book. Then they’d say “Ah, ah! This person is unknown. We don’t use it. I showed them the purple Greek interlinear book and pointed out that Jevovah wasn’t frequently used. And of course they said, “that book is old light.” I asked, “Sayeth who?” Interesting to note that they changed the subject by saying that there was a new discovery that presented evidence that the old interlinear wasn’t all accurate….blah blah blah… It was enough to make me want to cross my eyes. They are coming back and I ‘d like to have something solid to show them. Do you have any suggestions? I’ll appreciate your feedback.

  174. Ed

    How about teaching of cross vs stake? Very easy to win that debate.

  175. Based on what you told me, the only solid thing you can show them is THE DOOR.

  176. Ed

    Doug, Sending you an attachment re. Trinity for “1975 Survivor” I found it on line.

  177. A 1975 Survivor

    Thank you, Ed for suggesting the Trinity, unfortunately I have covered that plus Enoch and Elijah’s going to heaven without dying, Jesus being God, the 1975 thing, about the 144,000, etc. All I did was to show them what is being said from the Scriptures.

    Doug, you suggested I just show them the door. Are you saying that the couple is a hard nut to crack and I should not waste my time with them? They tell me I am so knowledgeable like a Berean but they believe I got wrong sources of information. When discussing with them, it felt like I’m holding the shield while the dragon blowing flames at me. Truthfully, I did all I could by showing them what is being said in the Bible. Nothing more. How sad that the couple couldn’t see what’s in front of them. The only thing left I can do, is to pray for their hearts to open.

  178. That’s all you can do. You can’t win an argument with these people because they don’t recognize anything as fact except what the Watchtower tells them. They won’t even give credence to the words of their own publications written during the 60’s and 70’s. If they are that blind to the facts then nothing you tell them or show them will help sway them.

    And yes, the door is all you can show them.

    Dad used to say “Never wrestle with a pig because you’ll only get muddy and pigs like mud.” The scriptures also give reference to throwing pearls before swine.

    Better to witness to someone who is actually sincerely searching for God.

    Remember: Christ didn’t come to preach to the Pharisees.

    Doug

  179. A 1975 Survivor

    Thank you, Doug for your advice. I will take it. I agree with you that I shouldn’t cast pearls among the swines. I want to add this: I told them I learned about JW and the upcoming 1975 when I was 12. They told me they had sold their house and gave away in 1974-1975 and spent a lot of time pioneering, or field service. When the Armageddon didn’t show up, they waited to hear from the Watchtower and then worked on getting their house back and still continue to believe it will happen soon. I find it hard to imagine to give up a house, business, etc., because someone told me that Jesus was coming and after doing those things, nothing happened. At least Jesus never said anything of that kind, because He clearly said that no one knows when He is coming, so right now I’m looking forward to His coming.

  180. We all want to help those who are blind to the truth about Christ. Yet even Christ Himself couldn’t help those of His day who continued to blindly follow their religious leaders.

    He stated that if other cities had witnessed the miracles Chorazin and Bethsaida had that they would have long ago repented.

    Spiritual blindness is a choice. JW’s are so proud and so willfully blinded that to see the real truth about Christ is darned near an impossibility.

    Doug

  181. Ed

    1975 Survivor, My only other suggestion to “keep it simple” Ask them simple questions with simple obvious answers that will prove the real truth. Get them to think for themselves. As you know they only accept what the WTB&TS tells them. Get them to ask obvious questions. Example, re. Stake vs Cross. note: “nails” plural in Jesus hands when crucified, the sign posted above His “head” vs “hands”, You can even use their NWT to prove cross. My experience has been, that they spend hours at meetings, assemblies and studying. Yet most of them know little about the Bible, they know allot about WT theology and can prove this by showing you their underlined WT magazines.

  182. A 1975 Survivor

    Thank you, Ed. You are right. The JWs whom I know only repeat what the WT says. I have asked them about certain verses and it was interesting that one of them asked me, “Who do you pray to, Jehovah or Jesus?” I said, both. I was trying to show them that the Watchtower made prophecies that did not pass at all. They told me that Jesus is ruling the world.. I knew right then that no matter how many verses from the Bible I have shown them that said otherwise, they won’t try to listen or at least think.

    Were you a JW at one time, Ed?

  183. Ed

    1975 Survivor,

    Yes i was, for many years, my Wife remains one. About 35 years ago while knockin’ on doors with a young Pioneer, now at Bethel. He’s been there his entire life. His Mom a Pioneer her entire life. His Dad (passed away) was an Elder, an awesome man! We met a man named Steve. We debated for hours. Long story short.. I started to question basic doctrines. Met with Elders, One a very good and intelligent man (albiet no formal education), wrote to Society. Answers were very poor. I sincerely believe the “intelligent” Elder knows better, yet he has too much to lose. He is a pillar in Congregation, his entire family are JW’s. The man, Steve, i met 35+ years ago is now my Pastor. I never forgot him or our conversation. He is an awesome man who does not judge me and loves me unconditionally. He is a true Christian, my Brother!

  184. Anonymous

    Thanks for your response Doug, btw I am not the anonymous person giving you grief, it makes no sense to me that Jesus would pray to himself and cry out ‘father why have you forsaken me?” Does it to you? The majority of my family is jw, hence
    the anonimity

  185. If Christ is of God’s same essence and is referred to as God then “God” must be a state of being instead of a person. Just as a human can create more humans, so God’s only begotten Son would be fully God and Colossians 1:19 bears that out in no uncertain terms.

    The fact that His followers worshipped Him on numerous occasions and this is cited in the New Testament, tells me that Christ is God just as the Father is God.

    Thanks for writing in Anonymous.

    Doug

  186. John

    Christ is GOD Jesus is GOD. I was not grounded in the poisonous doctrine of Charles Taze Russell growing up but another false doctrine that has reached even further. The point is, is that for a man to modify and change to his liking the written scriptures that have stood the test of time and is proven to bring salvation to the hearer and doer, and this man has shown himself in serious error as a false prophet at best, this man will in doubt be judged by the book he changed unless he found salvation in the words he removed. God knows. Let us be very careful in what we hear and from whom we hear it. When JW’s come all I can say is “Don’t Taze me bro!” (yes you heard it hear first 🙂

  187. THAT IS AWESOME! Don’t TAZE me bro! ROFL!

  188. Jesse

    Hello Guys,

    I am really grateful I have found this site. I have a problem and I really don’t know where to begin. Anyway, I was just recently married to a woman I have known and loved for almost 11 years. We have been through thick and thin and that is what I am always proud of. We had to deal with a long distant relationship and survive through it for 3 years before we finally decided to get married. What happened when she was away was something I didn’t expect. She attended meetings and have been good friends with JWs, although she is not yet baptised. At first I never knew what JWs really do and their doctrines were so I thought and felt nothing bad about it. Everything changed when I started to attend some of the meetings, as a husband would support his wife. I was really surprised of what they teach from the bible and the differences it interpret to orthodox christian teachings. That’s when I started to research about them and found out about their cult-like practices and ways. The problem here is, I think my wife is already really into this. She was already introduced as an “Unbaptised publisher” and she is planning to get baptised soon. I have no problem with the people in the congregation because they were so nice to me and my wife. But I think If I just let this be, I’m afraid I’m risking what my wife and I have. And I’m afraid of the changes and damage it can do to our relationship. It would be really helpful if someone can give advise. Thank you so much.

  189. Your relationship with your wife is about to change drastically if you don’t do something about it now.

    You need to sit down with your wife and have a long “heart to heart” talk with her about your concerns regarding her choice. Tell her that you know that Jehovah’s Witnesses have a reputation for breaking up families. Tell her that you’re genuinely concerned that it will break up yours.

    Tell her that before she commits to a lifetime of being a Jehovah’s Witness that she owes it to YOU to research the organization independent of the material that the Jehovah’s Witnesses provide her.

    Have her read my blog. Suggest that you both read Crisis of Conscience by Raymond Franz. Have her read “Apocalypse Delayed” by James Penton. Tell her that after reading my blog and these books, if she still wants to join the Jehovah’s Witnesses she can do so with no resistance or interference from you.

    If she refuses simply say this: “I’ve devoted the rest of my life to you. If you’re going to devote the rest of your life to an organization, apart from me, then you owe it to me to know everything about it before you go any further.”

    Don’t give ultimatums. Don’t threaten. Just show her your genuine concern for your relationship. There is a small chance that she may agree to spend some time reading with you regarding the group.

    If she refuses then you’ve already lost and the Jehovah’s Witnesses have won.

    Time to start putting together a contingency plan.

    Doug

  190. Garrett

    Well put Doug.
    As someone who was one of Jehovah’s witnesses for decades, what finally woke me up was the invention of the internet.
    Until it came about, it was not possible to research the history of this incredibly dirty organization . Their history was locked away in obscure books and in burned individuals who had no format, microphone , printing presses or other social media to tell their stories. When the internet came about , that all changed. Any topic that you want to research from Jehovah to Gyro-copters to jelly and jam is there on the screen in a nano second.

    The History Channel said that “Jehovah’s Witnesses have predicted the end of the world 9 times” this was very shocking to me. If true then it meant that they were not being directed by God, as the bible holds out the death penalty for false prophets.

    My research took me down a shocking road of discovery. In my possession I have 44 pages of quotations of false prophesies by the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses, and yet based on all I researched this was merely ONE point where they were grossly wrong and attempted to cover it up . I won’t even get into the blood guilt and lying and everything else I discovered. If the gentleman who fears losing his wife wishes to write me, I’d be happy to send him the 44 pages if false prophesies made by those bastards who run that cult.
    My address is:
    Iamicarus@me.com

    Best wishes
    G

  191. Garrett,

    Send them to me as well. I’ll see what I can do to post them up on the blog.

    Doug
    dougshields1@cox.net

  192. Jesse

    Doug and Garrett,

    I really appreciate what you guys are trying to do here to help me. It really feels good, especially with my situation. Thank you so much.

    Garrett, if you may please send the 44 pages to me as well. That would be one of my many good references. Again, thank you.

    Jesse
    carlosjuan.b@gmail.com

  193. Garrett

    Ok… Just sent it and a copy of Crisis of Conscience as well for desert….anyone else? Anyone else?… The soup is hot! Bueller?
    Bueller?…..

  194. Garrett you are hilarious!

    Doug

  195. Scott

    Hi Doug:

    Your article was absolutely excellent and very timely. I have been witnessing to “Witnesses” for about thirty years or so as the opportunities have availed themselves. I found arguing my proof texts with them (i.e., deity of Christ, Trinity, salvation by faith, hell, etc.) was problematic in many cases because ultimately their trust was NOT in the Word of God but in the WTB&TS and Governing Body, who they felt could give them an answer to some of my more difficult passages. That said, we know that the “Word of God is alive” (Hebrew 4:12) and that it will not return void. Recently I started to simply quote back to them their own materials which showed significant contradictions, track covering and a very honest admission that if one were to only read the Bible and not JW materials, that the individual would resort right back to the “apostate” beliefs and teachings of Christendom for the past 2,000 years. What an incredible admission! I then show them from Scripture that God’s Spirit speaks directly to us through His Word without the aid of any interpreter and then ask them if they read the Bible independently as Scripture instructs. This is very difficult for them. After that point, if they still hang around, I ask them how they would distinguish between a true and a false religion (admittedly all they can say at this point is that the teachings are in agreement with the Bible, and not, as we just discussed, in alignment with a fallible human organization). Finally, I show them from 1 Corinthians 15 what the Gospel REALLY is. I also show them how their corrupted NWT inserts and changes words to alter the meaning into a more JW-friendly theological bent. Just so you are aware, the newest edition of the NWT is even more deceptive than before. For example, in Colossians 1 all the square brackets that surrounded the unbiblical addition of “other” are removed so that the average JW would assume that other occurred in the NT Greek text. I could go on. God Bless!

  196. Ed

    Scott, Don’t give up! Your efforts may one day wake up one or many JW’s. I am proof that it can be done.After speaking with them, those with honest, hearts and open minds will look into the truths you share with them.God bless ya’ Brother!

  197. Anonymous

    Thanks Ed! There are about 7 JW congregations in our small city alone. They are very active and so if one congregation is warned about me (an “opposer” or “apostate”), it doesn’t matter because members of other local congregations just keep showing up! i know a seed was sewn in the heart of a fellow who came to see my twice recently. I just keep praying that God would release him from this hellish organization. Unfortunately, the disfellowshipping policy keeps a lot of disenchanted JWs in the organization for fear of losing family and friends. Scott

  198. Ed

    Anon, we speak the same language.. one of truth and freedom. Ed

  199. Scott

    Sorry Ed. I didn’t mean to post anonymous but I think it’s because I didn’t realize I had to log in first. Scott

  200. Ed

    Scott, No worries. This is a non judgment website for those seeking the REAL TRUTH!

  201. Anonymous

    when I confronted them with the scriptures they couldn’t answer me,then told me to visit their website to seek answers to my questions

  202. Yep. Standard protocol. They only want to talk with those easily led / manipulated (they know their target “customers”).

    Anyone who asks difficult questions is not the Watchtower’s ideal “customer” so they simply say: Go to the website and get your answers there.

  203. Alicia

    You summed that up perfectly, Doug! I was just having a “debate” with my JW husband the other day and was told to do my research on the website and find answers there. Anytime I pose difficult questions or make factual statements that may be in contradiction to their central doctrine, I always get fed the same, tired phrase that this is the only way to live & make it in this wicked system. I absolutely hate it when my husband doubts the credibility of my research & tries to refute it without even looking into it for himself independently. When I confront my husband with the Watchtower’s sordid past, he just blocks it out & says he doesn’t want to know yet claims to have done his research! It’s just mind-blowing to me how indoctrinated he is.

  204. Garrett

    Behold the power of the cult. People will believe a group of men who they have never met, seen or talked to, let alone interviewed and believe such lying bastards over their own family members who they have sworn to spend the rest of their lives with or who carry their own DNA and they have known their entire lives. Its just beyond sick.

  205. A cult member convinced against his will is of the same opinion still!

    Doug

  206. I agree Garrett!

  207. I find it quite hypocritical that Jehovah’s Witnesses badmouth the Internet when presented with any information that reflects poorly on the Watchtower while out of the other side of their mouths, when quizzed about a scripture they can’t explain, they’ll tell you to do your research on their internet based website.

    You just can’t make this stuff up!

  208. Ed

    I have an ideal photo i wish i could attach here. Its the one with 3 monkeys: 1 covering eyes, the other one ears and the third one his mouth. A truly fitting photo!

  209. When I used to talk to them on the streets, they called me ‘Bible Bill’. There was one time I showed them a Deity of Christ verse. I sensed the power, presence, and authority of God in a palpable way through His Word and Spirit. Fear came on them and they said I was demonized?! Ironically, they reject the true God, Christ, Spirit, gospel and teach doctrines of demons (consistent with spiritist Johannes Greber, etc.).

  210. The Pharisees accused Christ of having a demon so why should we be surprised when Jehovah’s Witnesses accuse us of the same?

    If they can’t beat you with Watchtower “logic” then that must mean you are demonized because how could you possibly win an argument against a Jehovah’s Witness? (Sarcasm intended.)

  211. Ed

    Doug, My Brother, I can introduce ya/ to a cat who performs Exorcisms! He will fix whats’ ail’n ya’

  212. Only if he can remove 23 years of Watchtower dogma from between my ears!

  213. Alicia

    Yeah every time I have a disagreement with my husband concerning watchtower doctrine, he gets mad & says I have the demons in me! Lol

  214. Alicia

    Garrett,

    It sickens me too how JW’s will put such implicit trust in seven old men from Brooklyn, but will never believe the words of their own loved ones. They even resort to attacking our characters by saying we’re evil because we don’t subscribe to the Watchtower’s brainwashing tactics.

  215. What else can they say right? They’ve got NOTHING so the only thing they can do is accuse you of something that can’t be proven or disproven.

  216. alena

    Hi again,
    I saw a jw with her magazines again with the headline, something about armageddon.

    I told the jw, ” Oh, I thought the end was prophesied in 1935, a few intervening dates and also 1975.” The jw came out with the latest phrase that has come from the organisation, “the light is shining brighter ……blah, blah, blah”, so, I asked the jw,
    “so does that mean that in 1975, God was witholding information about the now “new light” that the gb is now sprouting out, and why, as their interpretation of God, is all knowing and all powerful with a direct line to the governing body, why would their interpretation of God withold information about the new light in 1975 so stopping the organisation make a fools of themselves with yet another false prophecy of the generation born in 1914, or maybe their interpretation of God is not all knowing and all powerful; infact, maybe their interpretation of God means that their God did not know there would be new light, or

    maybe their God was a bit unsure of when armageddon was coming and unsure of the 1914 thing, and didn’t mind his faithful and discreet slave telling untruths about 1914, and was just stringing people along, or

    God was lying to the faithful and discreet slave when the organisation said that armageddon was coming in 1975, or

    that God did not trust the gb to give the whole truth, or

    that the old grey men are not listening properly to God, OR

    that God’s own organisation on earth got so many wrong dates and prophecies which were untrue, and they are just making it all up as they go along ? Or their God doesn’t know what He’s doing;

    And

    They are so scared of the internet, they threaten to disfellowship just for accessing an internet site other than their own, or for jw’s just to research the internet.

    I too look forward to the day that the jw organisation is completely scrapped from this earth. However, I fear that for as long as people want to oppress others, they will use some form of organised religion or belief system to have power over others.

    I have come to know God and Jesus through my own heart, living with an inner peace which I never had in the organisation. I just do good in my own life, treat others with kindness and love,

    With kind wishes to all who managed to get out, enjoy Christmas.

    Even to those who are still in, I wish you happiness and strength to question what you hear from the watchtower.

    Alena

  217. LOVE THIS!

    Thank you Alena!

    Doug

  218. alena

    Got plenty more, especially the stuff that the watchtower printed about women respecting, and treating with humanity a rapist attacking them.

    Oops , was that their God telling the faithful and discrete what to print in their watchtower magazine ? it would have be approved for printing by the entire governing body, ( they identify themselves as God’s organisation on earth), for the society to print it.

    Oops, their God must have got it wrong again, jw’s and watchtower now distance themselves from this statement, or their God got it wrong, again. What a mysogonistic organisation.

    I’m not having a go at individual jw’s, but at the organisation which brainwashes people, my sisters at the kingdom halls went along with these belief protocols, they were so scared of losing their families and support networks, people are afraid of losing everything, their thinking is institutionalised.

    Love to all

  219. Ed

    Alena,

    I had to look up the word, Misogynist

    A misogynist is a person who hates or doesn’t trust women. Misogynist is from Greek misogynḗs, from the prefix miso- “hatred” plus gynḗ “a woman.” The English suffix -ist means “person who does something.”

    If i was still a JW i may not ever have known the definition! Ya’ know, since the Internet is a method Satan uses to mislead those seeking answers. Unless of course it appears on official WT website.

    In Christ,

    Edward

  220. alena

    Being greek, I knew that mysogyny is a perfect word to describe the society

  221. I’m reminded of their antiquated and predominantly Catholic view of masturbation. They actively teach that masturbation leads to homosexuality. What they fail to tell you is that a full 95% of men masturbate at some point in their lives while only 1.8% of men self identify as homosexual.

    As usual, when their flawed ideas meet with the cold light of day they implode.

    You are absolutely correct Alena! The primary reason that JW’s remain in the group is social. It has nothing to do with God. It has everything to do with their own fears of losing their friends and family.

    Doug

  222. I thought it was someone addicted to massages Ed!

    Okay, just a little humor on a Sunday morning.

    Doug

  223. Again absolutely dead on correct!

    Doug

  224. SAMUEL BAIDOO.

    DOUG AM NOW A MEMBER OF DEEPER LIFE CHRISTIAN MINISTRY, free from the wt dogma by your help. doug remember me SAMUEL BAIDOO. i really thank you. i thought that only wt teaches the truth and the most vibrant msg – but my this christian assembly is really biblical: life after death, hell, trinity, jesus as alfa and omega, countless to heaven etc.

  225. SAMUEL BAIDOO.

    ANY ONE HERE SHOULD BE OPEN-MINDED AND SEARCH MORE FROM GOOGLE. THE GB AND WT ARE NOW BANNING THE MEMBERS NOT TO VENTURE INTO SUCH ZONES! STUPID OLD RATS DENYING THE DEITY OF CHRIST!!!!! THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD. IT IS TRUE THAT GOD OR JEHOVAH IS HIGHER THAN CHRIST according to HEBREWS 1:1-8 , AND IT IS JEHOVAH WHO AUTHORISED HIM AND EVEN ADDRESSED HIM AS GOD (PLS USE NIV BIBLE AND KJV) BUT WE SHOULD NOTICE THAT JEHOVAH DID NOT DENY OR GET OFFENDED TO CALL HIM GOD AND THOMAS DID THIS WITHOUT CHRIST’S REBUKE – EVEN THOUGH JEHOVAH IS HIGHER THAN JESUS IN SOME SENSE- BCOS THE DEIFICATION CAME FROM JEHOVAH TO JESUS, WE STILL SHOULD NOT COUNT CHRIST lower LIKE A MERE god (nwt john 1:1-) fool wt leaders!!!!!!!!! modern day farisees and saduccees

  226. SAMUEL BAIDOO.

    i will come here some day, visitors take care in CHRIST!!!

  227. I’m happy for you Samuel. Thanks for visiting the blog and letting us know that you’ve progressed out of the WT.

    Doug

  228. Ken

    Hi Doug, Just had a thought, and it is this: if one will look at the Bible, you never once see the fearononi (just made that one up) in any of the disciples or apostles at being questioned about what they believe. In fact, wasn’t on Mars hill that Paul declared that this UNKNOWN GOD was the one true God that was being heralded. You don’t see the kind of fear mongering that goes on within the watchtower society one wit in the bible. Come on now class (I am not speaking to the authors here or contributors, but to the newly being indoctrinated would be “witnesses”), who are first being controlled by fear. I know, I am dealing with some now, two 54 year twin sisters. The one is a witness, the other is living in fear of hearing anything else but Watchtower Propaganda! What a shame that there are organizations that feel they must do all the thinking for their followers, and the bigger shame is there are people who themselves have no idea how gullible they are being in all of this.

    God Bless,

    Ken

  229. I agree Ken.

    1 John 4:18

    “There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.”

    Yet we see so much fearfulness in Jehovah’s Witnesses because the Watchtower has made Jehovah, not into the loving and kind God that He is (hint: He’s a lot like Jesus!) but into some unbiblical “Boogieman” that scares little children and adults into fearful submission. I would venture that most Jehovah’s Witnesses are more fearful of their version of Jehovah than they are of Satan himself. The Watchtower constantly reinforces their vision of God with scenes of violence and mass death (nuclear bombs etc.) on their magazines and in their publications.

    They hammer their flock with scriptures that are specifically picked out to scare the flock into working hard for the mother organization.

    Scriptures such as

    Matthew 10:28:

    “Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.”

    Having this perverted vision of who God is the Jehovah’s Witnesses constantly run circles trying to please (in vain I might add) Jehovah with their works. Theirs is a transactional redemption in that they feel if they do enough, are good enough, and attend the meetings enough that they “probably maybe” (Zephaniah 2:3) will be spared when the great day of God the Almighty comes.

    I often wondered why the “probably maybe” was constantly harped on by the WT when the New Testament clearly stated that all those who believe in Christ would be granted everlasting life…period.

    (Note: The 2013 version of the NWT has taken out the “maybe” part probably because they have been called on the carpet for reading way too much into that scripture and using it as a key “whipping point” for the rank and file.)

    It comes down to employee / employer relationships.

    When you have an employee who thinks he’s got a lock on his or her job they may not work as hard. They may slack off and just do what is comfortable. However, if you have an employee that is in constant fear of losing his job he will work long hours, weekends, and sacrifice other important aspects of his or her personal life in order to keep the job.

    This is how the Watchtower creates slaves for themselves. Jehovah’s Witnesses are never certain of anything except that if they don’t do what the Watchtower says to do that they will die. Since their faith is in dates, works, and in the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society and not in Christ they are easily manipulated by the Watchtower’s principle of “transactional redemption” which is a complete and utter perversion of Christ’s message.

    Let’s face it: Constant fear of a “forever death” is a pretty strong motivator for a worker bee in the organization and this is the driving force behind every single work that Jehovah’s Witnesses perform. It is the equivalent of holding a gun to someone’s head and telling them if they don’t knock on doors on Saturdays they will die. This is also why many long time Jehovah’s Witnesses suffer from mental illness. They simply can’t take the strain of decades of self denial and the constant fear mongering of the not so faithful or discreet slave masters.

    Sad but true.

    Doug

  230. mike daniels

    As a former witness who grew up as 1 …and having been in many churches on my spiritual search, let me that although true, i have found it is far from unique to them,,i know quite a few members and preachers of many denominations with whom you cannot disagree religiously with without the conversation turning very nasty. Thankfully I don’t Jesus acts that way.

  231. You are so right Mike!

    While JW’s can be narrow minded, holier than thou, and insist that they are right and everyone else is absolutely wrong, sadly, they aren’t unique.

  232. Judy

    I’m happy to have found this site. I’m a nice person and have opened my door a few times to the JW’s who have knocked, figuring it was harmless to chat a moment. Realizing it was getting a little strange, mine was the only house they stopped at and they were starting to get pushy with bible studies, videos etc…I had already said I wasn’t interested but that didn’t stop them…I’ve stopped answering the door and now it’s gotten really bad with them constantly knocking, 4 times to be exact this week and a long letter from the lady. Now I understand why. If I post a no solicitors sign on my door will they stop? Hoping that will stop the harassment.

  233. Ed

    Maybe. They may knock and say: “We’re not soliciting, we are encouraging Bible reading” Post a sign: NO JEHOVAHS WITNESSES PLEASE. Thanks, Ed

  234. Tell them to leave you alone and they should but you will need to stand up for yourself and tell them.

    Otherwise, they will continue to hammer on your door.

    Doug

  235. Ed

    Judy, Perhaps you should consider printing a short list of easy to read, truths for them to take. Display the love and concern you have for them.Keep it simple! Reach their heart! If they read the info, perhaps they will start asking questions of their leaders, who will not have legit answers. If you need help with list. Let me know. I’m certain Doug can help as well. This may scare them away.. they’ll consider you an Apostate and not come back. I wish you well.

  236. Ed

    or…. ask them to explain 1914.. Do a quick search of “Stauros vs Cross” Do not let them scare you with their “knowledge” They are absolutely ignorant to the truth as supported by archaeology, history, common sense and more importantly, scripturally.

  237. Judy

    They hammered on the door again today, that makes 5 times now this week. It surprises me that they have no shame. I’ll expect to see them again tomorrow, so I’ll try the sign first. Unfortunately, they’ve taken a liking to me because I was honestly nice and willing to talk for awhile. At the same time I also told them I wasn’t interested, they were waisting their time with me and they should spend their time helping others who needed it. I was raised Catholic but now consider myself a Christian and try and be the best person I can be. So of course, I’m kind to others, including them. The main lady who comes also wants to buy fresh eggs from me as I have a small family farm. I never did as I suspected it would be another reason for her to knock on my door. I’m just going to have to get firm with it. Thank you for all of your help!

  238. It’s called a “hook” in con artist jargon. If they have a “hook” like “buying eggs” then they have a reason to show up besides talking religion. Yet the primary reason for a JW to show up at your door is one thing: Converting you to their religion.

    Doug

  239. Ed

    Doug, You are correct.. sort of! The primary reason is to count time, place mags and make sure the Elders see them at meeting for service. They pile 5 to a car, drive around making RV’s after 30 minutes of knocking. Total time speaking to people 5-10 minutes each, time counted 2 hours each. comical!!

  240. Time Gossiping = Time Counted.

  241. Ed

    I forgot to add.. “magazines placed” that is, under doormats never to be read only to be thrown in the trash!

  242. Garrett

    Judy
    1) try personal questions to reach their hearts… I.e. . “What is your favorite Black Sabbath Album?”
    “Roni james Dio or Ozzy Ozbourne as preferred singer for Sabbath?” Remember to kindly let them respond
    with heartfelt responses…

    2). Option B – insert boot “A” in ass “B” … Repeat until said boot remains stuck or subject retreats to
    safety of mini van.

    (I really don’t know why Doug allows me to comment on this blog… I am I guess the pit bulls with fleas
    you never saw in the bushes as you deliver the mail. He knows my virulent hatred for all things
    Watchtower.

    Greetings from Belize… Biking all through the jungles … Yes ..in combat boots and a Sabbath shirt..
    peace to all.

    Garrett

  243. They make great liners for birdcages. Parakeets LOVE ‘EM!

  244. Ahh Garrett. Your humor is so refreshing!

    Hope you have a great time in Belize. I’m living vicariously through you sir.

    Doug

  245. Hi have looked at your web site on many occasions about a year ago I had a run in with the elders in the Cong in this case I had actually reported wrong doing how ever instead of them carefully investigating the matter to see if I had been telling the truth they just ignored me and I actually lost my privileges to this day I am still baffled by there covering things over just so the Cong would look good.

  246. They “shoot the messenger” as a matter of course.

    How does it feel to be “iced out”?

    I had that happen to me as well. I sided with the wrong people against the daughter of the Presiding Overseer at my congregation when she was involved in some underage drinking. I was involved too and I “copped to it”. I felt that the complaint was valid and that we all needed to confess and do the right thing. What happened was a total shock as it turned into a huge “witch hunt” and the people who brought the complaint to the body of elders were totally humiliated by the PO and his cronies. The kids who were actually involved in the drinking were slapped on the hand and sent home. However, because I stood up for the ones who brought the complaint, I was completely “iced out” and was relegated to the same punishment and characterization as the kids who brought the complaint.

    Doug

  247. Micah

    Its funny how you should mention the CO cause i’d even written a letter to him which I was entitled to do instead of showing me so compassion and empathy he basically just ignored me went off with the other elders and didn’t even bother to check all the facts out I finally called someone in the Service dept in Brooklyn its so interesting how they won’t tell you there name anyhow the brother kind of showed abit of emphyaty at first then when I mentioned what the elders had done to me, he all of a sudden stated “I don’t believe you” and suddenly had to end the call. I was totally shocked and dismayed, is this how we treat our brothers when there down and out?

  248. They’re doing you a favor Micah. Remember that the only reason many of us are free of the Watchtower lies is because we were mistreated and that got us questioning things.

    I don’t begrudge anyone in the JW’s. They are doing what they’re programmed to do.

    Doug

  249. Edward Acuna

    Email to my sister a Social worker with no religious affiliation;

    In part:
    I do not have a problem labeling this whole thing as an utter display of total pathetic, ignorance on Lisa’s part. She closes her eyes, ears and refuses to talk about this. Why? She views me as a threat to her religious convictions. She blames my ”illness” on the changes I have made.

    This and other events have left me angry, alone and bitter.

    Angry at myself for allowing JW to steal so many years of my life, angry for instilling beliefs in my children.
    Alone because very few fully understand how I feel. I joined a website support group made up of former JW’s. There are horror stories from individuals in much worse condition than me as a result of JW’s religion. No wonder the *mental problems among JW’s are higher than average as a whole.
    Bitter at what the leaders continue to do, to members who blindly follow them.
    I now feel disgust when I see Elders/Leaders out knocking on doors. Yet feet very sorry when I see children or women who do not know any better.

    Please check out this site:

    http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/mental-issues.php

    *Despite a lack of reliable scientific studies, there is consistent indication of high levels of mental illness amongst Jehovah’s Witnesses. There are a number of reasons why this could be the case – isolation from general society, an unrealistic view of the world and the destructive nature of the threat of disfellowshipping. Total reliance on a leadership that claim angelic direction, yet have a string of failed prophecies and doctrines, leads members to fear the religion may be wrong but fear leaving, leading to cognitive dissonance. Those that do leave are often inadequately prepared for life and lack a support group that would normally be developed in a healthy upbringing. Additionally, people with mental illness can be attracted to religious groups and the loving brotherhood that they promise

    Lisa blindly follows Watchtower theology and views me as sick and pathetic for leaving her religion.

    As I wrote previously.. I could write a book and I assure you, I am not crazy or mentally inept. Frustrated? Hell yes, because I cannot help those I love. They simply refuse to listen. They throw me out of their home, when all I want to do is help them, open their eyes!

    I am eager to hear your opinion. Especially because in your profession, you see family dysfunction problems on a regular basis.

    Ed

  250. Micah

    Some interesting facts but like any business organization they don’t want to speak about the negatives, so they only focus on the positives, however this does not fix the issue. Ever bought a lemon, i mean a car that never seems to run properly now you very rarely ever hear the manufacturer ever saying how bad there cars are, they will always focus on the good things like look at how many Drivers in NASCAR have won races with our brand of car or ABC company have owned our brand of car for so many years and have always gotten good service at our work shops while that is true they don’t tell you about all the other customers that haven’t had good service and have had heaps of problems. WT uses the same tactic they will always write in articles about brother or sister so and so has had lots of support when they lost there partner etc etc while that may be true in Bethel there are lots of reports that go against that theory If there a member of the Branch or a CO they get the red carpet or Royal treatment so there always pampered and think wow look at how loving everyone is but fail to see or notice how the fatherless boy, the widow, the lonely, or the depressed ones are being treated, they just assume they are being shown the same love that they were shown which is not true and totally biased.

  251. Just like anything else man made.

    Politics, favoritism, nepotism, and plain old fashioned neglect and cruelty all exhibit themselves in the workings of Kingdom Halls and their body of elders.

    Nobody wants to hear or talk about these things. Nobody wants to discuss suicides, divorce, pedophilia, and destruction / alienation of entire families; at least not openly. They do so but only in hushed tones and only with those who have been around a long time. They will never discuss the congregation’s dirty laundry with anyone new in the group.

    They’d rather talk about the Watchtower “poster children” who put the Watchtower first in their lives and everything “magically” turned out for the best.

    Blah blah blah ad nauseum!

    Doug

  252. Micah

    I’ve heard the term brain washed and mind control however here are another couple of theories there’s hypnotism and the “Hypodermic needle theory” the idea that the media is injected into a person’s mind in a way that renders’ them passive and susceptible to the intended message of the sender. Off course the media can include Newspaper,Radio, and TV. I would of personally left the truth 20 years ago the only thing that really made me stay funny enough was the fact that they were the only one’s actively preaching the Good news Worldwide. I know i know everyone’s going to say well there are other faiths and i do accept that however the truth was the JW’s were reaching more people than anyone else that’s a fact unless i see other evidence to prove otherwise. Having said that i’m not pro JW it way seem strange that i’m saying that too however here’s why about 18 months ago for the first time ever i actually broke the golden rule and viewed some “opposer” websites and interestingly i learnt quite alot for example i knew nothing about the “Beth-sarem” (The house Mr Rutherford built) I knew nothing about the big pyramid built near Mr Russels grave, I knew nothing about the false god Ra’s emblem boldly emblazed on the studies of the scriptures books. The letter acknowledging the WT where members of the UN as a registered NGO, this despite the scathing attacks on the UN in the Revelation Book. And the false prophecy by Mr Rutherford back in 1925 where he claimed and stated quite clearly that the bible said so we would see Abraham Isaac, Moses etc etc all resurrected so convinced that they would actually appear in San Diago? This really shocked me really bad because none of this was a lie yet the WT people will say how bad so called opposers are. Then i thought about Jeremiah and how he was treated when he warned other fellow worshipers what did they do to him? Need i say any more….

  253. William,I love to listen to everything Doug had to say about Jw.because he tells the truth he is insightful ,he is fair and balance. But Rutherford,not so much,his leaderships” brought much suffering to JW .tell me how come Rutherford didn’t show up in germanly and preach along with the German JW? He was not interesting about Gods kingdom ,did you know Rutherford neaver knock on doors .

  254. ddenis pratt

    Fuck off

  255. Garrett

    Mr Pratt,
    Good sir.
    What is the name of the congregation you attend?

  256. It’s okay Garrett. He’s reacting to apostate thinking so the end justifies the means.

    LOL!

  257. Edward Acuna

    I tried to engage a JW I met while he was set up outside a store, distributing WT literature. This is a partial conversation email thread. He no longer wants to talk to me.

    From: notwoodward@gmail.com
    Sent: ‎Friday‎, ‎April‎ ‎17‎, ‎2015 ‎9‎:‎07‎ ‎PM
    To: Edward

    See, it’s comments like that that make me not want to continue with you. We are not forbidden from talking to people who challenge our beliefs. I feel like you are trying to provoke me into an argument, or at the very least embarrass me, by choosing subjects that you feel will be controversial or where you hold the upper hand.
    I stated my reasons in my first email for having a conversation, and because I feel we no longer meet that criteria I will not be participating anymore.
    I sincerely wish you the best in your quest for truth.
    Jesse
    On Apr 17, 2015 8:33 PM, wrote:

    Jesse,

    My Friend. OK, I expected it would end this way. I understand WTBTS forbids you to have intelligent, open, honest, civil conversations with anyone who challenges your beliefs. Why?

    I have read some of the info regarding 1914. I am not sure I fully understand. It appears that there have been many changes.

    I sincerely believe most JW’s do not understand what current, official WT understanding is regarding “the end” and 1914.

    I will check out WT article you listed and reply with questions or my thought. I hope you will reply.

    Pour your heart out to Jesus, Gods Son, who died for you.

    I will pray for you, my Friend.

    Edward

  258. Garrett

    Hahahaha!….Its open season on Jesse!….SPAM ATTACK!!!!….

  259. Edward Acuna

    DOUGLAS, My Bro!!! Your such a devil! 🙂

  260. Edward Acuna

    Incidentally, I read the info Jesse sent regarding 1914. It was a bunch of “hogwash”.. something about two (bloody) groups?!!!!! Huh.. what the.. pardon my ignorance.. but i don’t comprendo!! Me no understand wat yu talk’in about!!??

    My questions to poor Jesse:

    The article WT14 1/15 mentions.. “two groups”. As I interpret, WTBTS continues to teach: “those on hand” (1st Group) in 1914 and those “contemporaries of the first group… who were not simply alive during the lifetime of those in the first group” or (2nd Group).

    Those alive in 1914 are either dead or over 100 years old, contemporaries must be how old?

    These (second group) will be alive when end comes?

    How can “this generation” be interpreted to include two different, overlapping generations?

    WT14 1/15 THIS GENERATION WILL NOT PASS AWAY

    14 There is yet a third reason for confidence. What has developed among God’s people points to the nearness of the end. For example, prior to the establishment of God’s Kingdom in heaven, a group of faithful anointed ones were actively serving God. When some of their expectations about what would happen in 1914 did not come about, what did they do? Most of them proved their integrity under trials and persecution and kept right on serving Jehovah. Over the years, most—if not all—of those anointed ones have faithfully completed their earthly course.

    15 In his detailed prophecy about the conclusion of this system of things, Jesus said: “This generation will by no means pass away until all these things happen.” (Read Matthew 24:33-35.) We understand that in mentioning “this generation,” Jesus was referring to two groups of anointed Christians. The first group was on hand in 1914, and they readily discerned the sign of Christ’s presence in that year. Those who made up this group were not merely alive in 1914, but they were spirit-anointed as sons of God in or before that year.—Rom. 8:14-17.

    16 The second group included in “this generation” are anointed contemporaries of the first group. They were not simply alive during the lifetime of those in the first group, but they were anointed with holy spirit during the time that those of the first group were still on earth. Thus, not every anointed person today is included in “this generation” of whom Jesus spoke. Today, those in this second group are themselves advancing in years. Yet, Jesus’ words at Matthew 24:34 give us confidence that at least some of “this generation will by no means pass away” before seeing the start of the great tribulation. This should add to our conviction that little time remains before the King of God’s Kingdom acts to destroy the wicked and usher in a righteous new world.—2 Pet. 3:13.

    I responded with questions. I do not expect the poor chap will respond.

  261. Garrett

    I keep it simple. Deuteronomy 18:20-22.
    False Prophets were to be put to death…not followed.
    The leaders of the Watchtower Society have predicted the end of the world more times
    than any other cult, religion or sect in the history of mankind.
    If God does exist,…if the bible is His book…then they are dead as doornails.
    If someone carries the Watchtowers literature to the doors and promotes it, they are guilty of
    what the bible calls “sharing in the sins of others”….1 Timothy 5:22…..accomplices to Watchtower leaders crimes.

  262. Edward Acuna

    Douglas, Please read this article re. This Generation 1914. Pretend i am 6 years old and explain it to me.. will ya’?

  263. Edward Acuna

    WT14 1/15 THIS GENERATION WILL NOT PASS AWAY

  264. So basically what he and the Watchtower are trying to say is now there is a third class of Jehovah’s Witness. There’s the “Jew” and the ten men who grab hold of the skirt of the Jew and now, apparently. there are ten more men who grab hold of the skirt of the ten men who…

    Sounds like a religious MLM meeting!

    I don’t think I have enough breadcrumbs to find my way home Gretel.

    Doug

  265. Micah

    Though it may seem like i’m sticking up for the witnesses i know personally i would not have an issue discussing any of the topics you’ve raised perhaps the person was embarrassed by their lack of knowledge on that topic. I know personally i knew nothing about alot of the false prophecies what really made me think was when i read about what Mr Ruderford said regarding 1925 and how the ancient worthies would be resurrected the building of Beth Sarim these were all true facts and this disturbed me i used to wonder why they never included these publications in the WT library on CD prior to 1935 having read some of the older issues i now know why there is so much stuff in there that exposes their false prophecies.

  266. A 1974 Survivor

    Hello Micah, you can check out the website called Strictly Genteel. It had the old Charles Taze Russel and Judge Rutherford’s published books and Watchtower newspapers. The present JWs told me that these are very old light and they don’t recommend looking up the past. The younger JWs covered their eyes if you present these old publications to them. I kid you not!

    A 1975 Survivor

  267. Garrett

    Yes, I love how they call it OLD light…haha
    …instead of just saying “we were wrong ”
    Imagine scientist calling “old light” :
    1- the moon is made of cheese
    2- the world is flat
    3- earth is the center of the solar system

    That was hardly “enlightenment”.

    It shows just what an incredible lack of humility the watchtower leaders have always had to not be able to openly admit their errors. That is why so many sites like this exist exposing their false doctrines because they don’t have the humility or honesty to do it in their own.

  268. Edward

    Douglas, I’ve never seen a Jew wearing a skirt? Do Jews wear skirts in yer neck of woods?

    Brrrruuuuuu.. (head shaking..) me don’t crompendo all dis nonsense!! My hats off to ya’ Dougie! You understand all the hocus pocus!! Oh.. wait i don’t wear a hat!! 🙂

  269. Anonymous

    Hi, a previous person named as Anonymous asked the question “it makes no sense to me that Jesus would pray to himself and cry out ‘father why have you forsaken me?” Does it to you?” This bible quote has always led me to believe that Jesus must be the Son of God and not God himself, but I am totally open minded and am looking for answers.

    One other question, is the Jehovah’s Witness religion the only religion that believes in a Paradise on Earth? And if so, how do they justify it Biblically?

    Your blog has been a tremendous help to me and I appreciate all the effort that goes into it.

    Anonymous

  270. It could be said that it makes no sense that the Son of God wouldn’t have the same qualities as God. If I had a son, he would be human just as I am. If God had an only begotten Son, then that Son would be God in the same way the Father is God. There are many many scriptures that agree with that contention. John 8:58, John 1:1, Colossians 1:15-20, Isaiah 9:6, John 10:30, John 20:28, Revelation 22 regarding the Alpha & Omega.

    Most of these scriptures have been completely altered by the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society to mean something entirely different than the actual Greek. This is by design. If you want the full impact of these scriptures then read them in any other translation but the New World Translation and you’ll see what they are supposed to mean. You can also see them in the Greek Interlinear of the New World Translation in the actual Greek translation.

    With regard to paradise on earth the scriptures are very clear: Revelation chapter 21 in its entirety explains the plan of God for the earth.

    Doug

  271. Anonymous

    Thank you Doug. Very much appreciated.

  272. ruthlee

    hi how did all of this get so messy when truth is so very simple i can only summize pride before a crash and as my dear old dad would say the bigger they are the harder they drop oh pray for the day but yet again it seems absolutly increduloius that we were so hoodwinked for so long i do feel stupid but on the road to recovery

  273. We’re all on our own path of discovery Ruthlee. Don’t beat yourself up too much. We’ve all been down the road you’re on.

    Forgiven

    Doug

  274. The 1975 Survivor

    Ruthlee, be thankful you woke up and jumped out of the La La Land of Jehovah’s Witnesses!

  275. ruthlee

    thank you for your kind and loving comments need these at the moment as i havent been brave enough to make the final jump

  276. Edward

    Ruthlee, my dear “..get out of her (JW’s) My People..” Please know, you are not alone, nor will you be alone. You have Douglas, Me and many who visit Dougies site. You also can visit a local Church who will help, support and love you unconditionaly. Search out a church in your neck of woods where you feel comfortable. There are many! Do not be overly concerned about the name on the building. For centuries the cross was a sign on a building to inform people that Christians meet here. Visit a few until you feel comfrtable, safe, happy and feel the love that Jesus promised. Keep us posted and write with questions or whaterever.. Go ahead and jump, you will feel relief and free.. at last, free at last!!

  277. ruthlee

    thank you so much for the encouragement im really at the fading stage right now we are going to the yearly beating ie convention this wkend not my assigned one so at least i will be anonmyous this summer is tricky as things unfold i will explain to you on this site what happens i know that sounds a bit too intriguing but i have posed a question that has involved our body of elders and they have all sat up and did not know the answer so one genuine bro has promised to do his research and yes has come back to me saying he is in the process of finding out so i want to stick around to get my answer because if i leave just now my children WILL be caught up in the crossfire i pray often why is it me that always seems to ask these difficult questions and not someone else sorry to be so vague but when i get my answer i will inform you you will be quite amused with love and sincere thoughts to all my bros and siss ruthlee

  278. Garrett

    I would love to hear your question.

    “Batter up !”

  279. 24 Elders of Revelation?

  280. ruthlee

    hi have just returned from convention went to one as anonymous which took the pressure off usual stuff very little spiritual content not much mention of the kingdom but what i will say is this many of the points mentioned were direct counterpoints aimed at the xjw community so they know we are reading for ourselves and have to mention certain objections but i dont think those asleep would have got the point it was for us who are all ears anyway no new light as im aware a few vague threats from the storm coming i will remember my brolly! doug i dont want to go off topic but i want to bring a question to you now that ive had time to think its reguarding our charitable status and the loop hole i think ive found which has implications certainly in britain but maybe elsewhere do you want me to post here or on a different section of this site thanks ruthlee

  281. Feel free to post here.

    Doug

  282. ruthlee

    hi ive got several questions for you the 24 elders is a start any ideas question number one is the revelation all symbolic no 2 who go to heaven and why was the earth originally for humans but did they sin with the angels so became corrupted so needed a ransom do you think the jws were set up to do a work and maybe protect the anointed until now as there seems to be so many who know their calling but feel it is time to distance themselves i feel jws did get the bible out there and as soon as you read it for yourself its obvious the lord calls the work they do is coming to a finish and they flounder also they bang on about not going to heaven gulp this is the big Q do you think they dont deserve to go to heaven as it is not seen as a wonderful privelege and a fantastic honour from our Lord but just an alternative not for rank and file?

  283. Question 1: I don’t know.

    Question 2: I don’t know.

    Question 3: I don’t know.

    The message of the gospels, if we read them honestly, is that faith in Christ is all that is required for salvation. Everything else, and all the answered questions in the universe pale in comparison.

    Doug

  284. ruthlee

    hi thanks for replying so promptly i do have many more questions but i suppose all will become clearer in time if it is meant to be i am coming to my own conclusion about many things already but sometimes you just need another voice or other points of view in futre i shall keep you posted if i feelconfident enough i find this site so informative and there is genuine concern for all thanks once again ruthlee

  285. Anonymous

    Theres more than just reading any bible there are facts about bible mistranslations or verses that are not even to be there in tge first places

  286. And who better than to tell us which scriptures should be there and which ones shouldn’t than God’s own self appointed representatives on earth…right?

    How To Write Your Own Bible by Lorri MacGregor

    First off, make sure you have absolutely no scholars trained in Hebrew and Greek from any recognized University or School of Theology. After all, your purpose is not really to “translate” but to “alter.” Keep your goals in mind. Ignore real scholarship.

    Make sure your translating committee is identified as “anonymous” so they can’t be easily checked out. Tell your gullible followers that this constitutes “humility.”

    Make sure at least one of your anonymous “translating committee” was a short-order cook in his previous life, before being appointed to the committee. Any other occupation will work just as well as long as there is no linguistic training involved.

    Have one of your claimed Hebrew Scholars be unable to translate a single Hebrew sentence when challenged to do so under oath during a court trial. Hope that you never have to be exposed this way. The embarrassment is intense. Just hide it from your fol­lowers as best you can.

    Make outrageous claims with no basis in fact such as: “We offer no paraphrase of the Scriptures.” “As nearly as possible, word for word, the exact statement of the original” (page 10—Kingdom Interlinear Translation). Then do the opposite.

    In the absence of reputable scholars, turn to not-so-reputable ones like Johannes Greber, a defrocked Catholic Priest who received his “translation” for his New Testament through his spirit-medium wife. Don’t ever ask why Watchtower doctrines are the same as the doctrines of demons, just press on. Maybe no one will ever notice!

    Oops! When caught red-handed using sources like Johannes Greber, claim you had no idea he was into spiritism (even though you were in possession of his other book, Com­munications with the Spirit World of God, all along) and promise followers you won’t quote him anymore! However, just leave his wrong concepts incorporated into your New World Translation. Memories fade and new converts come along who won’t remember the debacle. When caught in a lie, deny, deny, deny!

    Turn to other cults who also deny the Deity of Christ like the Christadelphians, and even obtain the copyright for their altered New Testament to try and bring credibility to your own. Also find a couple of very obscure sources to endorse you. Hope nobody looks at them too closely.

    Ignore the outrage expressed by scholars who expose your errors on John 1:1, where you refer to Jesus as “a god.” These include the late Dr. J. R. Mantey (misquoted by you), Dr. Bruce M. Metzger of Princeton, Dr. William Barclay etc. etc. The list goes on and on. Ignore this list.

    Where the Bible text does not suit your doctrine, just put in your own twist on the matter. Use brackets sometimes, but not always, to keep people on their toes. Also add words that change the meaning of the text. For example, the word “other” should be added four times in Colossians 1:16-17 to reduce Jesus from Creator to Jehovah’s right-hand angel in creation. Simple, but effective. Use it often.

    Muddy the waters where Scriptures show Jesus Christ was worshipped by his followers. Use the correct word “worship” when Jehovah is involved, but change this same Greek word to “obeisance” for Jesus. Do what you have to to disguise the fact that Jesus is God. Then redefine “obeisance” to your followers, calling it a “gesture of respect.” Never, ever, tell them that the believing Jews bowed down and worshiped Jesus, recognizing Him as Jehovah. That would never do. Cover it up at all costs!

    Do away with all the references to Jesus coming to indwell believers. Replace these embarrassing scriptures with new phrases suitable to your doctrine, like replacing “to know Him” with “taking in knowledge of him.” Don’t let readers know they can trust Jesus directly for their salvation—make them turn to the organization, and get “knowledge” from you. Keep their eyes off Jesus and on you! You keep control of your flock with an iron fist!

    If your readers, despite your best efforts, do somehow manage to see they don’t need your organization, but only Jesus according to the scriptures, look them right in the eye and tell them the New Testament was written to only 144,000 select Jehovah’s Wit­nesses. It is not for them! Reprimand them severely for criticizing you and threaten to disfellowship and shun them for disloyalty or apostasy! Attack, attack, attack! Never be on the defensive. Don’t ever answer honest-hearted questions.

    To avoid having your manufactured bible questioned, forbid your followers to talk to anyone who has left your group. Forbid your followers to go on the internet at all. Warn them that looking at the websites of “apostates” is the same as looking at “pornography.” Encourage everyone to become a watchdog and report offenders. Make sure your fol­lowers become increasingly paranoid—use the “us against them” philosophy, and call it “Christian persecution.” This goes a long way.

  287. ruth lee

    hi Doug have not posted for a few weeks well things have moved on a little and im making progress. I took your advice and started an intense study of the Bible and lo! and behold! the Truth is really out there, like you Doug i realise so many things with reguards my friendship with Christ it really does not match up with what weve been taught in fact the truthof the Bible is so simple.Its crazy how the boys in crooklyn have complicated matters. i decided to obtain a copy of the Message Bible its great what an uplifting translation i want to post a long post about faith and realisation but honestly Doug you have said it all. What i will say is that ive been on a few sites now but your articles have lead me to the Truth. it is so simple and loving and liberating i know my destiny. also i have work here to do and its not knocking on empty doors. You know you are so right about how nasty jws get if you disagree with any pet subject, its astonishing how they change and act in a way our Lord would not find joy in. I do like this site the best for clarity and thought. What heartens me is that this is a gradual testimony of many and is on record. we know our sincerity and all those who want to sabotage are wasting their own time.i want to share this one thing now i am seeing my way clearly i actually worship THE ALMIGHTY for the very first time in my life its amazing and wonderful a new birth and new life i never knew any of this and to be able to express my feelings freely is just great so please indulge me a little because i just had to say something thanks to all the friends who wrote back words of love and encouragement peace to all a fledgling sister in Christ ruthlee

  288. Ruth Lee,

    I’m so happy for you! You are one of the very few who actually follow my advice and you’ve seen what I’ve seen as a result. God’s word is really just that simple and salvation is just that simple. It is man who complicates things, not God.

    Thank you for posting on your progress and for contributing your heartfelt thoughts to the website. This is real life, real time, real power of God stuff and it is unfolding in front of all of us.

    My goal was to do one thing: Determine what the Bible actually said to me and then to try to make sense of it. The funny part was, I didn’t have to make sense of it. It was right there in front of me. The whole agenda of the Watchtower leadership is to convince us that the Bible is impossible to understand without their direct influence and teaching. Nothing is further from the truth. You see they can’t burn the Bible or it’s readers so they do the next best thing: They convince the unsuspecting that they can’t possibly understand it and they need the “seven old men” to tell them what it means. They have, in tandem, introduced their own version of the Bible and have convinced their followers that theirs is the only correct version and that all other translations and versions are to be considered biased, incomplete, and without authority. By doing this the Watchtower leadership has effectively stopped anyone from questioning their translation, at least those who wish to remain in the good graces of the organization. They have effectively put words in God’s mouth as a result.

    Once we go down that path we become enslaved to the Watchtower as you and I both were.

    I’m so glad that you’ve released your bonds and that you are now free, forever, in Christ.

    Your brother,

    Doug

  289. ruthlee

    hi Doug and friends to have a conversation with a fellow brother in Christ is to put it mildly Awesome like you to realise how simple our Lord put things actually seems beyond me that we as humans have complicated things. The scripture comes to mind about blinding the minds of people because when the blinkers are off you cannot go back to erronious teachings of demons or deny Christ ,in effect you would have to gouge out your eyes and no one in their right mind would do that. We talk about the eyes being the window of our soul ,too true our literal eyes are the extension of our brain so our spirituea life becomes clearer as we see things as God intended us to see them. It grieves me as a human how the KIngdom has been shut up to genuine sincere folks i know this is all in Gods hands but the human tragedy is stupendous the cost of humans life lost ,maimed damaged,beyond recognition is a bitter harvest to see. It is so ruinous to the human condition i wonder what the final judgement will be in fact if we see the earthly manifestation of this it will be earth shattering however if we are united in Christ at that time we will have full understanding. Meantime im just toddling along this path of light that our Lord has shown me so blessings to all you dear ones hope all this makes sense your sister ruthlee

  290. It’s amazing how your words are still littered with what I term “JW Speak”. The chronic use of the phrase “as humans” is one telling reminder that you spent a long time in the Jehovah’s Witnesses. The use of “spiritual life” versus just plain old “life” is another.

    Please don’t take that as criticism. It isn’t. It’s just an observation as to how deeply indoctrinated we all were at one time.

    There is nothing new under the sun and while a lot of former JW’s feel the sting of their prior affiliation and try to make the JW’s out to be worse than they are, the fact is that the Watchtower leaders are just one group in a long list of offenders against God and man.

    The scripture comes to mind: “Man has dominated man to his own injury.” No truer words could be applied to the Watchtower leadership than these. From the hateful power mad Pharisees on down through the corrupt and murderous dark age Popes, into the Protestant Reformation and now into the 19th, 20th and 21st century Jehovah’s Witnesses, there have always been those agents of Satan standing at the ready to steal the victory that Christ freely gave to God’s children. These agents teach their followers a different gospel and then proceed to enslave them to their own (per)version of redemption. This was foretold by Christ Himself so it can’t come as much of a surprise to anyone who has actually read their Bible.

    Again, congratulations Ruth Lee on getting out of that snare. I can tell you that helping others to free themselves from these bonds is quite a rewarding experience. I highly recommend it.

    Doug

  291. ruthlee

    hi doug points taken i dont know if i will ever be free from the taint of indoctrination. It seems like a blemish that is a permanant fixture.Who knows all I know is that each day things get better and stronger. i accept what you said and really that is the point.We who have woken from deep slumber are floundering a little because our former friends are so so hostile they inflict the gagging order.In time i will find a safe haven but this interim its a stab in the dark as far as people are concerned.Trying to help others is the only way so i thank you very very much for your logical reasoning it has been of great help i will post in about one year from now God willing blessings ruthlee

  292. I have decided to keep an open mind in other words just observing what WTS say and what others say keeping in mind 1John4:1 “Do not believe every inspired expression but test the inspired expression to see whether it originates with God” I have not been out in field service now for 5 months one more month and i will officially be listed as inactive in this time i’m personally observing what members in the congregation including elders are doing to encourage me after all if its a “loving” organization and we’re all “Friends” they will be going out of their way to show me: love, encouragement, compassion, empathy its when your down and out you really find out who are your “true friends”. So far not so good. I think of the illustration Jesus used when asked who is truly your neighbor, who was the one who helped the injured man? And who was it that walked on by and ignored him?

  293. You’re seeing the other side of cult life Micah. On the front end of high levels of service you see a tremendous amount of what is referred by Steven Hassan as “love bombing” where they validate your work with inclusion in the upper echelons of the group. When you’re a full time pioneer it seems everyone wants to be seen with you and have you over to their home etc. However, when you cease to be productive, the love bombing stops and the “beat downs” begin. You’ll experience being snubbed, ignored, and talked about. You might even experience a good “talking to” by some of your prior “friends” where they berate you and question your love for Jehovah (aka the Watchtower). You see the same behavior in gangs.

    You’re beginning to see things for what they truly are and this is causing some conflicted feelings within you. This is referred to as “cognitive dissonance” by psychologists. One day you’ll be absolutely certain the Watchtower has “the truth” and the next day you’ll be equally as certain that they don’t.

    It’s normal. Just enjoy your ability to think critically and pay attention to how you feel and what your thoughts are. Try to notice what triggers them and where those strong feelings come from. You’ll learn a lot about yourself and the cult you’ve been involved with.

    Welcome to the awakening my friend!

    Doug

  294. Yes when i think about my life in the truth i was just so programmed into thinking it was the truth and no matter what any outsider said i would refuse to listen after all what would they know right? Some things have happened to me over the last 2 years that have really opened my eyes to what i would never have noticed, or should i say what i have noticed but was in denial. Love bombing unfortunately I’ve never been love bombed perhaps if i had i would still be a true believer, after all we are supposed to love one another. I have traveled to quite alot of congregations all over the world and i can say quite accurately that most i’d say up to 98 % of congregations that i have attended were cold, unfriendly and unwelcoming and looked at you like in those Pale Rider western movies with those leering stares. I view my thinking almost like an abused wife, people often say why didn’t you leave your husband if he treated you that way and most wives just answer either they didn’t know where to go or they felt they were at fault or to blame, i was like that i thought the treatment i was receiving was to punish me for some sin i perhaps had committed.

  295. Arnold Alega

    I love Jehovah God … am hopeful things might change in the organization … still praying for them, who governs us …

  296. Be careful you don’t “wait on Jehovah” so long that you end up failing Him and yourself in the process. If there are so many problems in “God’s spirit directed organization on earth” then perhaps you, and millions of other Jehovah’s Witnesses are giving them far too much credit. Better take a really hard and objective look at the reality of this organization and start making some personal decisions.

    Doug

  297. Dawson

    I’m trying to get a friend of mine, who is a JW, to at least question the reasons she believes what she does. However, she is very stubborn, very defensive and very closed to the idea of change. She is also very emotional, not just when talking about religion, (more like avoiding it) and can’t very well see logic a lot of the time. She’s very young and I’d like to prevent her baptism for her own sake. I’ve got a couple of years to do that, but I’m not waiting around. She is very close to me and both looks up to and trusts me, yet won’t seem to hear a word of protest (however kind and indirect) about anything to do with her religion. I’d love to get some advice on how to try to at least open her mind to change.

  298. Dawson,

    Read Combating Cult Mind Control by Stephen Hassan. It will help you.

    Knowing the mechanics behind mind control enables you to understand what “levers” to push to help someone. Understand that frontal assaults do not work. Attacking the belief isn’t what you need to engage in so much as giving them alternatives to their current “lock step” in the organization. For example:

    You: “You know Lisa, if you go to college you’ll have a great future.”

    Lisa: “I’m trusting in Jehovah to provide for me.”

    You: “Well you know Paul was a tent maker by trade. He had to learn that somewhere. He didn’t just “pick it up”. Even Jesus was a carpenter. Why not give higher education a try? You do so well in school anyway!”

    Lisa: “I might just do that.”

    Give your friend alternatives to just going to meetings and field service. Invite her to do things you know she enjoys doing a lot. Get her involved in other things that challenge her and validate her worth as a person. Perhaps you could invite her to volunteer at the local animal shelter. Anything that gets her out of the mind control and into a healthy environment is a great way to give her freedom from the intensive manipulation that she experiences in the Kingdom Hall.

    Doug

  299. Dawson

    Thanks a lot Doug! I’ll try to start reading the book as soon as possible and I’ll have a little discussion with her sometime this week. I really appreciate the quick response and great advice, it’s amazing that you’re giving time to help out anyone who comes to you with a question!

  300. Thanks for your kind words Dawson.

    This is just as therapeutic for me as it is for others that visit this site. It is my way of giving back to the JW and former JW community. It is at once a labor of love and a process of self-healing. I believe it is a work that God wants me to do.

    Doug

  301. Arii Rowling

    Thanks for the article! I am not Baptized. I was an unBaptized publisher. I got a lot of pleasin nods from my Sisters. My study was very catty & said things to upset me on more than one occasion. I’m Bipolar. Something in me decided to stop going. I have a 6 year old little boy with Autism. We Previously went for 6 months. I have been unfriended on Facebook be JW friends. Me & my son are going to die. Do you have any Coping skills? Do you have any idea what the Truth Really is? I have been Depressed for a month.
    I Loved you
    r article!

  302. j

    I mentioned for a family friend who I work with to compare Acts 8:37 to what it says in her new world translation and she sent me back a message that she wasn’t going to argue. Who was arguing? I told her that she wouldn’t find it. She said that we were not going to talk about it anymore. Just the day before she said she was open to hear what I had to say. She said she checked out the organization (she’s been in it for 12 years) and its not a cult. But I know for a proven fact it is. She said that she was tired people thinking they knew more or that they knew better than her, and stormed off. I’m saddened.

  303. Edward

    I’m confused. Why is this scripture Acts 8:37 not in NWT?

  304. j

    It is a statement in it declared by the Ethiopian that Philip was ministering to. It says..”I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God”. He’s don’t believe this. They believe in the Trinity.

  305. Cathy

    I’m so glad I found your blog. My sister seems to be getting involved with JW. Not sure how long and to what extent yet. Your posts are helping me work through my concerns.

  306. Edward

    Please take the time to speak with her before they corrupt her mind. They will convince her that Family, Friends and “the world” will be her enemies. She will then not listen to anything you have to say, regardless of how intelligent, smart, simple and proper it is. Get her to carefully consider both sides of arguments or teachings. Stay simple, not complicated, depending on her current knowledge and abilitiy to comprehend. Please keep in touch. I am happy to send info. edacuna58@charter.net

  307. I’m glad to be of some help to you.

    The posts, comments by readers and the interactions help people on the outside figure out the strategy of this cult and how they work.

    I hope it gives you enough to use to get your sister out of the JW’s before she completely gives her mind over to them.

    Doug

  308. Bob Anon

    my first and last post as I’ve spent two days reading your blog. Not sure I’ve read it all though. I’ve come to the conclusion that if anyone disagrees with you Then they must be a jw. I am not. I left some twenty three years ago. I did not experience a single thing that you have said in your blogs. They have never discouraged people in my experience of not seeking psychiatric treatment from psychiatrists. I myself was treated by one for depression no less. I have not seen the hierarchy you mention regarding the congregation. I have on the other hand seen imperfect humans with a common goal making mistakes and not making mistakes. I always think back to the thought from Jesus when he said about noticing the splinter in your brothers eye and missing the branch in your own. Luke 6:42 (paraphrased). I am truly glad that you felt relief when leaving the witnesses. I did not. I struggled like others on here. I still believe in Jehovah. I believe in his son Jesus. I wanted my post to show others that will come here that it’s not easy but you don’t have to hate the witnesses or the society. Or vehemently disagree with them to survive Finally a sister visited me about four years ago. I did not know her nor the congregation but she just said to me that not all people need to be witnesses to survive. I took that to heart. Last scripture but my favourite of all. Psalm 24: 1-5 says it all really.

  309. Bob, I find it extremely hard to believe that you haven’t experienced a single thing mentioned on this blog. If your time in the JW’s was such a good thing then why aren’t you still “in”? Why would you spend two days reading every post on this site? You’re obviously searching for something.

    If your time in the JW’s was as innocuous as you maintain, why not either stay in or leave and let that be the end of it? Why go so far as to invest two days of your limited existence reading the posts of people who are, in your opinion, writing complete fabrications?

    Here’s what I think:

    a. I don’t believe you read much, if anything, of my blog. You’re attempting instead to legitimize your claim that this blog is somehow deceptive by stating an obvious falsehood.

    or

    b. You’re completely out of touch, only spent a very short time “in”, or you’re living in complete and total denial.

    Personally I think you’re a JW “plant” attempting to discredit a website that you vehemently disagree with by posing as a “disinterested third party”.

    We get all kinds here. Some JW’s fly into a rage and rant, use offensive language, and call me all kinds of names. Some read and never post. Then there are those, like yourself, who, I believe, wish to deceive as many possible readers of the blog as you can.

    Doug

  310. Anonymous

    Amen Doug! JW are very subtle in there deception. It does require some intelligence to see it and courage, true appreciation for Jesus sacrifice to do something about it. After 23 years Bob must still be under the influence of WTBTS or is lacking in his ability to “see” it. Regarding “hating JW’s”. I nor most people on Blog hate JW’s. I, feel extremely sorry for them. Now, my opinion of Society is a bit more harsh. Not hate, but anger and sadness too. I’ve visited Bethel and know young men who have spent many years there. They are smart, polite, awesome public speakers and outstanding citizens. Yet, they are absolutely lacking in their ability to think “outside the WT bubble”, almost robotic. I’m happy for Bob and hope he is at peace.

  311. Hi i can relate to what both sides are saying i can understand why some “witness” would disagree with what is said you see those that are in the right group or clique never have those problems cause their always showered with love and so when someone like me says i don’t feel loved or welcome they wonder what my problem is. I remember i’d even phoned the local bethel headquarters and spoke to someone they just mocked me and pretty much just palmed me off like i was talking nonsense i wished i had of taped that conversation. I’ve been involved with the “witnesses ” for over 25 years and its the same old excuse “oh no ones perfect” however are vehemently critical of other religions if we’re not supposed to look at faults why criticize other religions? When the media criticize the witnesses its always “more lies” yet what if the media were to attack another faith would that also be lies too? Its interesting back at the end of WW2 when a reporter had written a story about the atrocities committed in the German concentration camps alot of people thought it was made up why? Cause it was so graphic that people thought it was impossible to be true, and this is exactly the same as what is happening amongst the witnesses they just can’t fathom or grasp the reality of it that the overwhelming majority are very selfish, unloving , uncaring, and inconsiderate.

  312. I agree Anonymous!

    Thanks for the comment.

    Doug

  313. Bottom line, he claimed he read everything on the blog. That covers a lot of ground that, if he truly was involved in the JW’s, he would have experienced first hand.

    Besides the many disturbing experiences related by those posting, the scriptural debates posed on this blog should have, at the very least, caused him some reticence to out and out call me and the rest of the participants on this blog “liars”. He didn’t say it “out loud” but he really did throw some rocks in my direction.

    His assertion that the use of psychiatry was never discouraged by the Watchtower leadership is a complete fabrication. Their own publications paint an entirely different picture.

    Again, I believe he’s a JW “plant” posing as a disinterested third party, when in fact he is quite interested in the outcome and effect of his post.

    Doug

  314. Edward Acuna

    Amen Doug! JW are very subtle in there deception. It does require some intelligence to see it and courage, true appreciation for Jesus sacrifice to do something about it. After 23 years Bob must still be under the influence of WTBTS or is lacking in his ability to “see” it. Regarding “hating JW’s”. I nor most people on Blog hate JW’s. I, feel extremely sorry for them. Now, my opinion of Society is a bit more harsh. Not hate, but anger and sadness too. I’ve visited Bethel and know young men who have spent many years there. They are smart, polite, awesome public speakers and outstanding citizens. Yet, they are absolutely lacking in their ability to think “outside the WT bubble”, almost robotic. I’m happy for Bob and hope he is at peace.

    Edward, Don’t know why “Anonymous” displayed?

  315. Anonymous

    My grandmother had an absolute fit when my mother told her I had found my own “religion” I have never seen her so riled up and smug as she was that day. It was crazy. My grandmother is quiet lady. Thankfully, I was never raised as a Witness but growing up I was always told that it was “the truth” had the kids’ book of bible stories and several of their magazines. I have quite a few relatives are who witnesses (an Aunt of mine just recently got baptized and I had a cousin get baptized last year). I know there are a lot relatives who even they aren’t Jehovah’s Witnesses but they still think it’s “the truth”. Honestly, I just don’t even know where to began. But I pray a lot about it It was back in August 2014 when I was dealing with really bad anxiety and panic attacks. I could barely sleep most nights. I thought religion could help. I read the what the bible really teaches book and when I came across the subject of blood transfusion I had a full blown panic attack. And when I did research on the subject there was so many inconsistencies. So taking blood transfusion is wrong but using certain parts of blood is okay? It didn’t make any sense to me. The more I researched the more upset and depressed I got. Nobody else seemed to be concerned like I was. I was just worrying to much. I needed to let things go. Then I stumbled upon scripture that exposed that dying doesn’t get your sins forgiven like Jehovah Witness claimed. I tried to show that to my mom but I was met with deaf ears. I don’t think my being upset helped anything so needless to say it didn’t go well. I found scriptures like John 14:6 and the correct version John 1:1. One night it just finally dawned on me that Jesus is the truth (though finding about hell was traumatic because I was always told that it wasn’t real). I hate that I’m so passive when it comes to my relatives but I’m at a loss at what to do for them.

  316. Live, love and be happy. That’s how you can help them and yourself.

    They aren’t having much fun and seeing you enjoy your life might be just the thing that makes them question their own beliefs.

    Doug

  317. Edward Acuna

    i found this comment very apropos, slightly edited to apply to me: A Basis for Belief

    So what do I believe now? Before answering that, I’d like to explain what is now my basis for belief, which is far more important. I believe that critical thinking is a vital life skill — one that is discouraged by JW organization and WTBTS.

    “Skeptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which deep thoughts can be winnowed from deep nonsense.” — Carl Sagan

    The only way to ascertain truth from fiction or erroneous beliefs is by using critical thinking. What is being claimed? What is the evidence validating that claim? Are there any other possible explanations? Can the claim be proved wrong with evidence? The more extreme the claim, the more evidence should be required. Since the first step of critical thinking is to gather data, the only way a person can do this is to be willing to look at multiple perspectives — some of whom might be unfamiliar or even once familiar. Perhaps due to our age, lack of
    interest in the subject when first taught or never studied deeply to truly understand the basis. However, Truth is not harmed by inquiry. Honest inquiry can only be done when we are free to imagine that our preconceived notions or current beliefs may be wrong. Diligent, honest, open minded study and review without prejudice is absolutely necessary to come to the absolute best outcome.

    One has nothing to lose and everything to gain by following this suggestion when considering important beliefs, practices and lifestyle that will have significant impact on you, your family and your future.

  318. I can’t help but contrast your comment with the following phrase that I used to hear (and repeat) at the door ad nauseum:

    “Well if your beliefs are true then you should be able to examine them using the Bible as the final authority.”

    Yet when that fundamental truth is reflected back upon JW’s and their leadership, they discount it, side step it, and reject it.

    Doug

  319. Edward Acuna

    Dougie, Do ya’ mean.. ? “..if your beliefs are true.. examine them using.. WTBTS as final authority..?” Ya’ know Gods organization on Earth!! Re. “ad nauseum..” pardon me while i puke!

  320. Amanda

    Just wanted to say your website is wonderful. I was raised a JW the first 18 years od my life and walked totally away when I was 18. I accepted Christ at 21 and have everyday for the last 16 years been so thankful that I finally found something that makes sense to me that doesn’t restrict me from every single little thing. I am lucky enough my family still talks to me and accepts that I believe different from them and dont disown me for it. My sister is the only one who wants to argue about it so I do not associate much with my only sibling. Good work on the website and keep it up helping other JW figure out what it they want or need to do. God Bless!

  321. Thank you so much for your kind words Amanda!

    It means so much to me when someone like you stops by and says “Hi!”

    Doug

  322. Steve

    I have just had this experience with my local JW’s who were giving out literature in the street. The main guy was the Elder and wasn’t willing to speak with me,but the other guy was slightly more open. They know me because I occasionally visit there Kingdom Hall because I was invited there so I went to see for myself what they get up to. I have read a lot of stuff about them and their beliefs so when I talk with them about topics like the Trinity they sometimes get a bit defensive. But today was a a real eye opener because the second guy, not the Elder was willing to talk with me but the Elder said he doesn’t want to talk with me accusing me of being intimidating and rude! I only ask them questions about their beliefs and the Watchtower and I am sure that any observer would not call me intimidating. However, as soon as I started conversing with the younger guy the Elder started to get very agitated and would interrupt to the point that he start getting personal and criticizing
    my intentions and saying that I am into ‘spiritual rape’! I told him to repeat this statement and he did so, 4 times!! I was shocked but at least the young man standing there saw and heard him make this accusation. The most amazing hypocrisy was that he is a tall big man and approached me several times very closely ,invading my personal space with anger, to the point that I had to say that I felt intimidated by him, and I actually told him that I felt he was being intimidating! All I was doing was asking questions and debating, I never raised my voice once or said anything personal to them. He seemed to be very churned up inside and he criticized nearly everything I said in a sarcastic way. When I left I shock his hand and said that I really care about them and thanked the young man for talking with me.
    I think pride is the major factor here and also fear. I just hope that they will still allow me to talk with them about the gospel and that they would at least understand that I am intitled to disagree and challenge what their publications say.
    Thanks for your web page Doug it helped me to understand his reaction.
    What should be my next step because my name is mud at the Kingdom Hall, and they all look upon me as a deceiver!! I actually think I might have made some progress today despite his reaction.

    Steve

  323. I’m glad you liked the page. Yes they have a pretty physical reaction to confrontation by someone with some knowledge of the Bible and what it actually says.

    Keep up the good work Steve!

  324. Edward Acuna

    Sounds familiar.. Consider example in Acts 7:54, 55. “On hearing this, the members of the Sanhedrin were enraged, and they gnashed their teeth at him. 55 But Stephen, full of the Holy Spirit, looked intently into heaven and saw the glory of God and Jesus standing at the right hand of God.”

    Yes, They certainly do “gnash their teeth” when exposed or confronted.

    Steve, your name apropos!

  325. Nice observation Ed!

  326. Mia Dvais

    hi Doug my name is Mia. I had a couple questions for you. What is your view of the Bible? And do you think it is inerrant?

  327. Edward Acuna

    Mia, I suggest you read Doug’s “My Story” at introduction. You will get your answers there. Edward Acuna

  328. Harley

    I had this happen to me today we had been caring for a boy for a few weeks an has recently moved with his aunty who has no children I said that I would be here for her to help out give advise etc, she visited today and during a conversation she mentioned she was jw and needed church clothes for him I offered a pair of my boys as we to go to church I told her we were Mormon and then the mood changed and she started to compare in a way I was feeling uncomfortable she made me pull out my scriptures and read with her and as she choose scriptures I realized she was trying to tell me my faith and beliefs were wrong she told me that certain things we do is a spit in the face to God felt sad for her as I began to get a worked up I texted my husband and told him he advised me to tell her I was not interested and that I was happy she found faith in her church but it wasn’t for me so I told her and she got even worse she talked my ear till 11 that night about the Bible I didn’t know what to do as my son and he’d nephew are like brothers and u feared standing up to her would ruin that relationship

    I mean every church has its truths and I am and I teach my children not to judge or run others down for what they believe it wasn’t the 1st time I’ve been bailed by a jw because of my faith to another church it’s sad they feel everyone should be an believe what they think and feel

    Thanks for the post was a good read

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